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This room is for discussion for anyone who adheres to the Extraordinary form of the mass and any issues related to the practices of Eastern Rite Catholicism.

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All,


As much as it may seem ridiculous to ask this question, I have had this discussion with someone before, and there seems to be an unfortunate stereotype that float around with the traditionalist label.


I've always viewed the Traditional Latin Mass to be an opportunity to give more time and prayer to our Lord such that we may hope to obtain special graces for our efforts, not only for ourselves, but for others as well. Does that mean I cannot at the same time employ my rather extraverted personality biggrin Have others seen this stereotype as well?

God bless,
Jim

Sep 6th 2012 new

(Quote) Jim-388330 said: All, As much as it may seem ridiculous to ask this question, I have had this discussion ...
(Quote) Jim-388330 said:

All,


As much as it may seem ridiculous to ask this question, I have had this discussion with someone before, and there seems to be an unfortunate stereotype that float around with the traditionalist label.


I've always viewed the Traditional Latin Mass to be an opportunity to give more time and prayer to our Lord such that we may hope to obtain special graces for our efforts, not only for ourselves, but for others as well. Does that mean I cannot at the same time employ my rather extraverted personality Have others seen this stereotype as well?

God bless,
Jim

--hide--



I don't know. I really don't. I would have to at least go to one of those masses and talk to some people there. I think a quiet mass would be a real treat in some spiritual way- My only concern is knowing where we were in the mass. Maybe I will try this soon! I tend to wish things were quieter at this point in my life- so who knows.

Sep 6th 2012 new

Some quick thoughts: You just can't stereotype it so easily. Spiritual matters are in a class by themselves. We are all different at different points in our lives too. It would be too simple to lump it all into one easy category. Life and people just are not that simple. Learning about the Church fathers and learning more about God (via Aquinas or other saint's writings)could deepen your experience to where you get more from another type of worship(for example a traditional Latin Mass).

Sep 6th 2012 new
(Quote) Jim-388330 said: All, As much as it may seem ridiculous to ask this question, I have had this discussion with someone b...
(Quote) Jim-388330 said:

All,


As much as it may seem ridiculous to ask this question, I have had this discussion with someone before, and there seems to be an unfortunate stereotype that float around with the traditionalist label.


I've always viewed the Traditional Latin Mass to be an opportunity to give more time and prayer to our Lord such that we may hope to obtain special graces for our efforts, not only for ourselves, but for others as well. Does that mean I cannot at the same time employ my rather extraverted personality Have others seen this stereotype as well?

God bless,
Jim

--hide--
Hi Jim, No, I haven't seen this at all, I find the Traditionalist to be outgoing, friendly and happy people. I am not aware of any stereotype here.
Sep 7th 2012 new

(Quote) Jim-388330 said: All, As much as it may seem ridiculous to ask this question, I have had this discussion ...
(Quote) Jim-388330 said:

All,


As much as it may seem ridiculous to ask this question, I have had this discussion with someone before, and there seems to be an unfortunate stereotype that float around with the traditionalist label.


I've always viewed the Traditional Latin Mass to be an opportunity to give more time and prayer to our Lord such that we may hope to obtain special graces for our efforts, not only for ourselves, but for others as well. Does that mean I cannot at the same time employ my rather extraverted personality Have others seen this stereotype as well?

God bless,
Jim

--hide--
I personally don't see a correlation, and am not aware of any.

Why can't a person be outgoing (or extroverted, as you say), and still be able to find a time for deep spirituality? Seems to be a good balance.

Sep 7th 2012 new

(Quote) Jim-388330 said: All, As much as it may seem ridiculous to ask this question, I have had this discussion ...
(Quote) Jim-388330 said:

All,


As much as it may seem ridiculous to ask this question, I have had this discussion with someone before, and there seems to be an unfortunate stereotype that float around with the traditionalist label.


I've always viewed the Traditional Latin Mass to be an opportunity to give more time and prayer to our Lord such that we may hope to obtain special graces for our efforts, not only for ourselves, but for others as well. Does that mean I cannot at the same time employ my rather extraverted personality Have others seen this stereotype as well?

God bless,
Jim

--hide--


Some are. I have seen this.

I love Traditional things, Latin, sacredness, formality, etc. I also love beautiful music, as opposed to the church picnic music we usually get at modern Mass. So, I have gravitated to the Tridentine Mass from time to time.

However, I have a close friend whom I introdiuced to it. He became more and more involved, to where his kids serve Mass, know the Latin and what it means, and are fully integrated into the community.

In the process, my friend has become mean, arrogant, fundamentalist, threatening, and rigid to the point where he will not allow me to even discuss evolution with his sons, one of whom wants to become a scientist.

I have watched the transformation of my friend since his involvement with the Tridentine community, and I've decided that if that is what happens to a person, I do not want any part of it. Jesus said you can judge a tree by its fruit. My friend has shown me that although he has the rules and the rubrics down cold, he does not understand a word of the message of Christ.

Christ's main purpose was not to bring a perfect Mass that we could celebrate in the language of the Roman conquerors, a language he did not even speak. He came to show us Divine Love. The Mass was a gift he gave us, in Hebrew and Aramaic, to strengthen our bond to him and to each other. The Church morphed it to Greek so everyone would understand it. Latin came 3 or 5 hundred years later. But, in any language, it is not about the Mass, it is about Christ's message, his love, and our need to show that love in our daily lives. If your parish doesn't have that, it doesn't matter whether you have church picnic music or Gregorian Chant; doesn't matter whether you are Tridentine or Novus Ordo, you have missed the boat.

My opinion. Sorry if I've offended.

Sep 8th 2012 new

(Quote) Gerald-283546 said: Some are. I have seen this.I love Traditional things, Latin, sacredness, formali...
(Quote) Gerald-283546 said:



Some are. I have seen this.

I love Traditional things, Latin, sacredness, formality, etc. I also love beautiful music, as opposed to the church picnic music we usually get at modern Mass. So, I have gravitated to the Tridentine Mass from time to time.

However, I have a close friend whom I introdiuced to it. He became more and more involved, to where his kids serve Mass, know the Latin and what it means, and are fully integrated into the community.

In the process, my friend has become mean, arrogant, fundamentalist, threatening, and rigid to the point where he will not allow me to even discuss evolution with his sons, one of whom wants to become a scientist.

I have watched the transformation of my friend since his involvement with the Tridentine community, and I've decided that if that is what happens to a person, I do not want any part of it. Jesus said you can judge a tree by its fruit. My friend has shown me that although he has the rules and the rubrics down cold, he does not understand a word of the message of Christ.

Christ's main purpose was not to bring a perfect Mass that we could celebrate in the language of the Roman conquerors, a language he did not even speak. He came to show us Divine Love. The Mass was a gift he gave us, in Hebrew and Aramaic, to strengthen our bond to him and to each other. The Church morphed it to Greek so everyone would understand it. Latin came 3 or 5 hundred years later. But, in any language, it is not about the Mass, it is about Christ's message, his love, and our need to show that love in our daily lives. If your parish doesn't have that, it doesn't matter whether you have church picnic music or Gregorian Chant; doesn't matter whether you are Tridentine or Novus Ordo, you have missed the boat.

My opinion. Sorry if I've offended.

--hide--

This is well stated and well explained. You stated it without offending others as far as I can tell.

Lets see if I can share without offending anyone.
I have had experiences where those who were involved in the Latin mass with whom I tried to discuss things with were closed minded and would not discuss things. They would go to novus ordo only to believe it was not valid. I don't want to start any debating by stating that--that is just some of the attitude we might run into..

I had a date with someone of the traditional type and I suggested going to mass and we went to a novus ordo mass and he was disturbed by what he saw as "smirks" on the extraordinary ministers faces as they distributed the Blessed Sacrament. He felt that the whole inside of the church looked like a Masonic Temple to him and he wondered why there were so many chairs lined up on the back of the altar. I found his comments and attitude disturbing. There was nothing I could do to reach any sort of peace about any of it in discussing this with this man. He has picked up specific beliefs along the way which are prevalent in these groups which make them suspicious of the more routine and novus ordo type of liturgical format.

I am writing this from a open point of view and I have no intention of offending anyone either. I hope I didn't.

Sep 8th 2012 new

(Quote) Gerald-283546 said: Some are. I have seen this.I love Traditional things, Latin, sacredness, formali...
(Quote) Gerald-283546 said:



Some are. I have seen this.

I love Traditional things, Latin, sacredness, formality, etc. I also love beautiful music, as opposed to the church picnic music we usually get at modern Mass. So, I have gravitated to the Tridentine Mass from time to time.

However, I have a close friend whom I introdiuced to it. He became more and more involved, to where his kids serve Mass, know the Latin and what it means, and are fully integrated into the community.

In the process, my friend has become mean, arrogant, fundamentalist, threatening, and rigid to the point where he will not allow me to even discuss evolution with his sons, one of whom wants to become a scientist.

I have watched the transformation of my friend since his involvement with the Tridentine community, and I've decided that if that is what happens to a person, I do not want any part of it. Jesus said you can judge a tree by its fruit. My friend has shown me that although he has the rules and the rubrics down cold, he does not understand a word of the message of Christ.

Christ's main purpose was not to bring a perfect Mass that we could celebrate in the language of the Roman conquerors, a language he did not even speak. He came to show us Divine Love. The Mass was a gift he gave us, in Hebrew and Aramaic, to strengthen our bond to him and to each other. The Church morphed it to Greek so everyone would understand it. Latin came 3 or 5 hundred years later. But, in any language, it is not about the Mass, it is about Christ's message, his love, and our need to show that love in our daily lives. If your parish doesn't have that, it doesn't matter whether you have church picnic music or Gregorian Chant; doesn't matter whether you are Tridentine or Novus Ordo, you have missed the boat.

My opinion. Sorry if I've offended.

--hide--

The question is whether the problem arose because of the community, your friend, or both. Even if the community bears a significant portion of the responsibility for your friend's change, on what basis do you generalize this to other communities?

Sep 8th 2012 new

(Quote) Jerry-74383 said: The question is whether the problem arose because of the community, your friend, or both....
(Quote) Jerry-74383 said:

The question is whether the problem arose because of the community, your friend, or both. Even if the community bears a significant portion of the responsibility for your friend's change, on what basis do you generalize this to other communities?

--hide--


Good points. I do not generalize or paint all with the same brush. I've met nice people in these communities. But, the OP asked if people had run into rigitidity, and the answer is definitely a yes.

Sep 8th 2012 new

(Quote) Gerald-283546 said: (Quote) Jerry-74383 said: The question is whether the problem ar...
(Quote) Gerald-283546 said:

Quote:
Jerry-74383 said:

The question is whether the problem arose because of the community, your friend, or both. Even if the community bears a significant portion of the responsibility for your friend's change, on what basis do you generalize this to other communities?




Good points. I do not generalize or paint all with the same brush. I've met nice people in these communities. But, the OP asked if people had run into rigitidity, and the answer is definitely a yes.

--hide--

Good subject.
I was baptized, made first communion, and was confirmed in the traditional Cathlic church from 1955 through the early 60's.
From my perspective; I experienced a more serious display of the faith; with respect to how we go about the Mass and behavior in the church.
Also, my Mother was raised by a Mother who had almost taken her vows at 18 to become a nun. (she left the convent married, and raised 4 children) I would say that I was exposed to very strict adherence to the faith. For example we did not eat meat on fridays; and was told that if we did we may end up on a path of damnation. Today we do not teach some of these religous aspects of the Catholic faith.

I also noticed growing up in a traditional Catholic community that most people would jenuflect when entering and leaving the church, and always when crossing past the cucifix; now I rarely see this being done. We were also taught not to chew the communion host; to allow it to disolve. We were taught not to open our mouths for a time after communion, even to sing. The choir was not to be in view of the parishoners, to keep all the thoughts and glory to Christ. We never clapped in applaud for anyone during Mass. Women from teenage years covered their hair, to keep modesty in our hearts.

Many other differences, but to me, kept us more focused on Christ rather than self and others.........
...are we more or less faithful Catholics, no..............
Like various tools for anything, can make a huge difference in how one acts, feels, and thinks.
I feel that this type of traditional teaching may have greatly affected how a traditional Catholic appeared to be, by others.
theheart

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