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This room is for the discussion of current events,cultural issues and politics especially in relation to Catholic values.

Saint Thomas More was martyred during the Protestant Reformation for standing firm in the Faith and not recognizing the King of England as the Supreme Head of the Church.
Learn More:Saint Thomas More

09/30/2012 new
(Quote) Charles-512043 said: I became aware of Bishop Paprocki's comments yesterday, and I couldn't agree more with them. Oba...
(Quote) Charles-512043 said:

I became aware of Bishop Paprocki's comments yesterday, and I couldn't agree more with them. Obama and Romney are both supporters of abortion, both supporters of an intrinsic evil. I will not be jeopardizing my soul by casting my vote for either of them.



www.youtube.com



"A vote for a candidate who promotes actions or behaviors that are intrinsically evil and gravely sinful makes you morally complicit and places the eternal salvation of your own soul in serious jeopardy" - Bishop Paprocki
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Charles,

This is a video of Bishop Paprocki stating:

"I have read the Republican Party Platform and there is nothing in it that supports or promotes an intrinsic evil or a serious sin."


(starts at ~3:45) vimeo.com
09/30/2012 new
(Quote) Jerry-74383 said: Since we don't know a priori the effect of a null vote (either not voting or votin...
(Quote) Jerry-74383 said:



Since we don't know a priori the effect of a null vote (either not voting or voting for a candidate that cannot possibly win) must be assumed to be the worst moral case.



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Why must we assume that?
09/30/2012 new

Well, I'm sure there are plenty of good candidates out there, but there are only two guys in the race. There's actually no guarentee that the primary process has to give us two qualified candidates.

(Quote) Cathy-620979 said: Nobody is good enough to be president.
(Quote) Cathy-620979 said:

Nobody is good enough to be president.

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09/30/2012 new

No, this is flawed logic, and we need to stop using it. I could just as easily say by not voting for Obama I am voting for Romney.

(Quote) Cheryl-409772 said: And again by not voting for Romney who is NOT promoting abortion or gay marriag...
(Quote) Cheryl-409772 said:

And again by not voting for Romney who is NOT promoting abortion or gay marriage or persecuting Catholic freedom of religion, you are voting for the other guy who is doing all these things!

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09/30/2012 new

(Quote) Matt-61677 said: No, this is flawed logic, and we need to stop using it. I could just as easily say by not voting fo...
(Quote) Matt-61677 said:

No, this is flawed logic, and we need to stop using it. I could just as easily say by not voting for Obama I am voting for Romney.

Quote:
Cheryl-409772 said:

And again by not voting for Romney who is NOT promoting abortion or gay marriage or persecuting Catholic freedom of religion, you are voting for the other guy who is doing all these things!


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No, it is not flawed...as I already explained....you could say that if you are a leftist liberal and you don't vote for Obama, you are voting for Romney...cause that vote belongs to him sure enough just as we can easily say if you are a prolife Christian and you do not vote for Romney that is as good as giving it to Obama....thing is...leftist liberals will vote....to be sure!

09/30/2012 new

Cheryl,

I did see the post by Charles and your response after I wrote it. It's still flawed. A vote for Romney is a vote for Romney. A vote for Obama is a vote for Obama. And a vote for nobody is a vote for nobody. The effect of voting for nobody might be that the other candidate gets in (yes it helps) but the vote for nobody is still a vote for nobody. To say a person casting no vote in race is voting for the other person is putting words in their mouth.

I agree there are two outcomes to this election; Romney or Obama. My vote has a pretty small impact on that. There are two outcomes to my life; Heaven or Hell. My vote has a far bigger effect on that. And I think honesty in voting your conscience is extremely important in that

Please note I am probably voting fpr Romney. He has really not impressed me with with campaign at all and I am dubious of his ability to lead the country well. I do really like Ryan, and Obama really is that bad. And there's hope Romney can lead well all this has been said.)

10/01/2012 new
No action IS action! Moral ramifications will result from inaction. There is moral culpability when one does nothing but passively stand by and allow evil to triumph. Especially when you were given the means to remove that which is evil. Obama's policies and plans are intrinsically evil from a moral standpoint. Obama's policies and plans attack the Constitution. Therefore, as a Catholic and as a U.S. citizen, one has a duty to vote him out of office/defeat him. This is even more critical since the race is so close.

On a side note: If our brave and dedicated military can risk life and limb for our Freedoms, the very least we can do is make a well-formed decision and fulfill our duty to vote.
10/01/2012 new

(Quote) Matt-61677 said: And I think honesty in voting your conscience is extremely important in that
(Quote) Matt-61677 said:

And I think honesty in voting your conscience is extremely important in that

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Voting a properly-formed conscience...

10/01/2012 new

Oh Charles, sweetie.....I sincerely hope you see the err of your ways in the next five weeks. I will spare you the narrative on what a truly good and decent man Governor Romney is in his personal life in addition to being extremely successful in economics, making him much more qualified than President Obama ever was to try saving an economy.

Moving on to more relevant topics:


1) Under a second term Obama, your and my taxes WILL be used to provide abortions to each and every female who chooses to seek one. Our taxes WILL be used to provide birth control to each and every female who wants it. That's what our taxes will be used for, and we will have no say about it. The only chance we have to get rid of this terrible health care provision is to elect Romney. This is the #1 reason he has my vote. Because there is only ONE way we have any chance at all of getting rid of Obamacare. Whether he repeals it completely or restructures it.....he WILL get rid of the abortion and birth control sections. He has no choice.


2) He has vehemently vowed to defund Planned Parenthood. Meaning our tax dollars will not go to an organization that provides women with avenues to get abortions, contraceptives, and birth control.


3) This may be the most important one of all: whoever is elected, WILL be naming at least two, maybe up to four Supreme Court justices to the bench. This will shape our judicial system for the next 30 years. Gay marriage, prayer in public places, parental consent on abortions. These are some of the great moral issues of our time. And forget Roe....if Obama is re-elected, Roe won't have a PRAYER of being overturned for three decades, at least. If we are to keep the bench conservative or at least centrist, Romney MUST be elected. There is no other option.


4) Governor Romney is extremely supportive of Israel and close friends with BiBi Netanyahu. Israel.....the birthplace of our faith. He does not just consider them one ally. He considers them THE ally. Our closest ally. The one we should protect above all others. President Obama has not shown Israel or Netanyahu that the United States is with them fully. This is the place of Jerusalem, Christ's home. As Christians and brothers and sisters (or more like cousins) to the Jewish people as well, we should have someone in office that reveres her.


If you still don't think there is a difference between Obama and Romney, I really don't know what to say. But, I will say this.....Romney has his feet held to the fire by worthy people- his VP, Focus on the Family, the Catholic Church, the Tea Party. You know who President Obama will be catering to? Unions, the ACLU, women who don't want to pay for birth control. Let's see.....hmmmmm

10/01/2012 new

(Quote) Charles-512043 said: I became aware of Bishop Paprocki's comments yesterday, and I couldn't agree more with...
(Quote) Charles-512043 said:

I became aware of Bishop Paprocki's comments yesterday, and I couldn't agree more with them. Obama and Romney are both supporters of abortion, both supporters of an intrinsic evil. I will not be jeopardizing my soul by casting my vote for either of them.

www.youtube.com

"A vote for a candidate who promotes actions or behaviors that are intrinsically evil and gravely sinful makes you morally complicit and places the eternal salvation of your own soul in serious jeopardy" - Bishop Paprocki
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Maybe this homily will help you, www.cacatholic.org
Also this from the Bishops,
32. Sometimes morally flawed laws already exist. In this situation, the process of framing legislation to protect life is subject to prudential judgment and "the art of the possible." At times this process may restore justice only partially or gradually. For example, Pope John Paul II taught that when a government official who fully opposes abortion cannot succeed in completely overturning a pro-abortion law, he or she may work to improve protection for unborn human life, "limiting the harm done by such a law" and lessening its negative impact as much as possible (Evangelium Vitae, no. 73). Such incremental improvements in the law are acceptable as steps toward the full restoration of justice. However, Catholics must never abandon the moral requirement to seek full protection for all human life from the moment of conception until natural death.

We have all posted...over and over proof of the Republican party's "limiting the harm done" to our unborn.

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