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Discussion related to living as a Catholic in the single state of life. As long as a topic is being discussed from the perspective of a single Catholic then it will be on-topic.

Tobias and Sarah's story is from the Book of Tobit, and his journey is guided by Saint Raphael.
Learn More: Tobias & Sarah as led by Saint Raphael

Oct 7th 2012 new

I don't know about the gap between Agape and Eros but thank you for your description. However, I do know that when a man knows what kind of woman matters in his life, and he makes it possible for her to become pleased with his actions, almost in super-hero mode to set the course for a happy start.

The problem is what happens later in the marriage. And this is where he loses the time to keep pleasing his wife. A wife will return the "giving" when she sees that the husband is giving from his heart, not just for a temporary prize. Marriage is about nurturing just like you would your own children. If you don't nurture each other, the romance wilts like a flower without the sun, and then eventually the love dies. No job, not even children should makes us stop nurturing the love we have for our spouses. Without the nurture in the beginning, we would have never gone further to even have children nor would it have been worth while to seek better job opportunities to improve our household.

So I say, romance is not selfish, it is nutrients to keep love alive.

Oct 8th 2012 new
(Quote) Kathy-635104 said: When I met my husband, neither thought came to mind. It was more of the agape definition, that I would lay down...
(Quote) Kathy-635104 said:

When I met my husband, neither thought came to mind. It was more of the agape definition, that I would lay down my life for you coupled with not being able to imagine a future without you in it. p>

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Good comment. I think it was Andy Griffith who said "When someone marries you the polite thing to do is to marry them right back." Part of love is letting yourself be loved in return and letting someone else lay down their life for you. How was it agape for you to decide to allow this man to attach his life to your life rather than to another woman's life?

Truth be told, this is all academic to me since I have not yet been in a situation where I have had the pleasure of deciding if a marriage proposal would be the appropriate thing to do.
Oct 8th 2012 new
(Quote) Matt-61677 said: Michael, Eros in the original Greek referred not only to romantic love but to passion in general; ...
(Quote) Matt-61677 said:

Michael,



Eros in the original Greek referred not only to romantic love but to passion in general; thus someone could have an erotic love for chess in the original Greek sense. And in this sense it's obviously not exclusive.



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Thought-provoking comment. Agape is an act of the will and eros is emotion. I don't know if it is correct to completely separate the two loves into such clean and neat categories but it will help with discussion. So assume that we have perfectly ordered our erotic passions under agape. That still leaves the question of how we decide that marriage is the proper course of action and is in the best interests of the other. Maybe I am being a little melancholic but I have never met a girl where I thought that a relationship with me as opposed to another guy would improve her life. well, at least not any girls to whom I have been attracted. My standards are such that I can't imagine dating a girl whose standards are so low that she would consider dating someone like me. scratchchin

Can you have agape toward yourself or is that a contradtion in terms? Maybe I should find a girl completely out of my league and pursue her as an act of self-sacrifical love toward myself?
Oct 8th 2012 new

(Quote) Cathy-620979 said: Which is another reason to prefer an arranged marriage system. Not only do arranged marriages tak...
(Quote) Cathy-620979 said:

Which is another reason to prefer an arranged marriage system. Not only do arranged marriages take off the pressure of romance and finding "the one", but they relieve everyone of the burden of dating, and allow agape front and center billing.

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I'd like to see how you'd react to an arranged marriage. Although my grandparents' marriage was arranged when my grandmother was 7 or 8 and my grandfather was 12 or 13. Then her family left Italy and returned to America. When my grandfather arrived here in his early twenties, he took the train to Cleveland, showed up at my great grandparents' house (no letters back then because everyone was illiterate). he and my 16 year oldf grandmother were wed a few days after his arrival. that was 1914. they stayed married until 1968 when he died.

Oct 8th 2012 new

I'd like to see how you'd react to an arranged marriage, too.

Oct 8th 2012 new

(Quote) Cathy-620979 said: I'd like to see how you'd react to an arranged marriage, too.
(Quote) Cathy-620979 said:

I'd like to see how you'd react to an arranged marriage, too.

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probably not too well.

Oct 8th 2012 new

Romantic love is not necessarily selfish. JPII wrote a lot on this topic. The challenge is to love our beloved in a self-giving way.

Oct 8th 2012 new

(Quote) Michael-756537 said: My standards are such that I can't imagine dating a girl whose standards are so low that she wou...
(Quote) Michael-756537 said: My standards are such that I can't imagine dating a girl whose standards are so low that she would consider dating someone like me.

Can you have agape toward yourself or is that a contradtion in terms? Maybe I should find a girl completely out of my league and pursue her as an act of self-sacrifical love toward myself?
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I understand what you are saying here, but I think what would need to happen is for you to find a girl who is so interesting to you that you forget about your own shortcomings and just enjoy and look forward to spending time with her. If she is very spiritual, you may be attracted to her joy, and it could seem like you could never know enough about her. And so that could be intriguing to you. And if she seems Christ-like, maybe you would not have to worry as much about rejection, because if nothing else she would be open to being your friend.

Also, regarding being melancholic, you might have higher standards than most, so you probably don't have to worry about someone else's standards, as they might very well be lower.

Oct 9th 2012 new
"Michael-756537 said: My standards are such that I can't imagine dating a girl whose standards are so low that she would consider dating someone like me. ..."

There you go, ladies! A moment of honesty from a man. I suspect if most men are honest with themselves, they would admit this.
Oct 9th 2012 new

Well it better be thought provoking! I took it from JPII and TOB!

How we decide if we should marry a woman is pretty simple: is it our vocation to marry her? How do we figure that out? Prayer and discernment! My opinion is that there is usually a right person at the right time. But part of that is being comfortable at were we are at now. We can't do anything in the future, and we can't change the past so stay in the present!

Also, you're a guy (yeah, I know, kind of obvious) and women like guys who are nice and manly, and we can all do that. I have a friend who's 5-9; 120 lbs and textbook geek, and acts it- Star Wars Conventions, lego's, math and science stuff. And he's dated lot's of attractive women with good self esteem, because he makes no excuses for who he is or what he likes, and knows how to treat a lady on a date.

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