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This room is for the discussion of current events,cultural issues and politics especially in relation to Catholic values.

Saint Thomas More was martyred during the Protestant Reformation for standing firm in the Faith and not recognizing the King of England as the Supreme Head of the Church.
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Oct 16th 2012 new

(Quote) Laura-56149 said: Laura, I agree with Cheryl. If you don't agree with voting for Romney, are you in ...
(Quote) Laura-56149 said:




Laura, I agree with Cheryl. If you don't agree with voting for Romney, are you in this thread just to stir up trouble?

The other thread was a total mocking of these threads, so she has every reason to defend herself from you.

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That's pretty ironic considering Patricia posted 8 times on the other thread, Mary posted 15 times, Cheryl posted 15 times and you posted on the other thread 4 times!

Sorry, I thought segregation was illegal:o)


You guys make me LOL literally!!!! Thank you!

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Oct 16th 2012 new

(Quote) Shannan-733493 said: I studied the voting guide that was passed out in my diocese at mass yesterday, and I listened to Card...
(Quote) Shannan-733493 said: I studied the voting guide that was passed out in my diocese at mass yesterday, and I listened to Cardinal Dolan on the Catholic Channel last week, and I have read the bishops guide for faithful citizenship, and they ALL STRESSED that they are definitely NOT telling people how to vote.
Peace.
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I think a clarification is in order. I think what the bishops mean by saying that they are not telling people how to vote is that they are not going to tell you which candidate you are supposed to vote for. But the bishops ARE telling Catholics how to vote in the sense of giving them guidelines for voting, which is what the guide for faithful citizenship is all about.

The bishops have also made it clear that there are some non-negotiable issues in this election. These include abortion, euthanasia, gay marriage, and religious liberty, the first three being intrinsic evils. A voter's guide provided by catholic.com states: "Intrinsically evil actions are those that fundamentally conflict with the moral law and can never be performed under any circumstances. It is a serious sin to deliberately endorse or promote any of these actions, and no candidate who really wants to advance the common good will support any action contrary to the non-negotiable principles involved in these issues." This means that Joe Biden, a so-called Catholic, is committing serious sin by supporting and condoning his party's position on abortion rights and other non-negotiables.

That's pretty clear. The next question is whether or not a voter is committing serious sin by voting for the Obama-Biden ticket. The short answer is yes, generally speaking, because a vote is an expression of support for a candidate and his/her positions on issues, and the Obama-Biden positions on the non-negotiables are sinful. Hence, Cheryl's warning that voters are sinning and thereby putting their souls in jeopardy by voting for Obama-Biden.

On the other hand, the long answer is that it depends. One might be voting for Obama-Biden, not in order to support their sinful positions, but for other reasons. One might decide to vote for an unacceptable candidate because the other candidates are equally unacceptable, the candidate will be unable to implement his/her evil agenda anyway once elected, etc. Thus, at the end of the day, the bishops won't tell us which candidates to vote for. We must examine the candidates and their positions and prayerfully make up our own minds.

But that having been said, it's clear to me, in the case of this election, that there are not any excuses for voting for Obama-Biden. This ticket has taken positions on the non-negotiable issues which are so sinful and awful, and they will be able to further advance their sinful agenda if elected. The "nuns on the bus" do not give us any good excuses for voting for Obama-Biden. No, Paul Ryan's budget is not intrinsically evil. The Church has not told us exactly how much government is supposed to budget for the poor. Listening to the nuns on the bus disparage the Ryan budget, one would think that Paul Ryan must have eliminated welfare and food stamps altogether in his budget; but that, of course, is not the case. What the nuns on the bus don't get is that the best thing that can be done for the poor right now is improve the economy.

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Oct 16th 2012 new
(Quote) Florian-626971 said: I think what the bishops mean by saying that they are not telling people how to vote is th...
(Quote) Florian-626971 said:



I think what the bishops mean by saying that they are not telling people how to vote is that they are not going to tell you which candidate you are supposed to vote for. But the bishops ARE telling Catholics how to vote in the sense of giving them guidelines for voting, which is what the guide for faithful citizenship is all about.

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Churches "aren't allowed" to officially endorse a candidate due to current non-profit restrictions. (Which Churches have started to protest/challenge.) NOT because they don't want to endorse a candidate! They walk a tight-rope for non-profit status!

This was provided by the Catholic Attorney who incorporated my non-profit years ago.

5 Things Non-Profits Must Never Do

1. Endorse candidates.

2. Contribute funds to candidates.

3. Use organization resources or staff time for candidate election activities (ballot measures are OK, subject to lobbying limits).

4. Provide mailing lists to candidates for free or below market rate.

5. Solicit candidate pledges: Nonprofit organizations cannot ask a candidate to pledge to do or not to do something in their campaign or in their eventual election. This provides implicit endorsement and is illegal.

www.reachandteach.com (scroll down for can do, can't do, maybe)

justlists.wordpress.com

www.arentfox.com
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Oct 16th 2012 new

(Quote) John-857142 said: Mary, I'm sure glad I'm not on your email list. Hardly have time to read ever...
(Quote) John-857142 said:


Mary, I'm sure glad I'm not on your email list. Hardly have time to read everything that interests me, much less every link friends send me.


Don't get me wrong. I think you are knowledgeable, passionate, and have a burning desire to help people get their heads on straight. Your selections are useful and appropriate, but perhaps a wee bit too many. If I were much younger, I'd give you a whirl to see if we could help each other achieve common goals, but as it is, you are among the few worth watching.

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boggled Um, John. Have you looked at the catholicvote thread? Our CATHOLIC CHURCH is up in arms about the notion that our religious freedom is at stake. This isn't about Mary having a burning desire to get people to have their heads on straight, it's about getting faithful Catholics to follow their church! Our church is speaking to us, we need to listen. Mary and others are just getting the message out because our national media no longer gives us accurate information.

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Oct 16th 2012 new

Did someone say that Ryan's budget was instrinsically evil? I'm pretty sure if that was true someone in the church would have commented on it. Pope Piux XII, Pope John Paul II and Pope Benedict XVI all agree that a nation should not be the sole provider of food, shelter or healthcare. Pope Pius XII called it Socialism. John Paul II and Pope Benedict XVI don't give it a name but merely describe it. Why? Because it cuts God out of society. And because it lumps people all together. And becomes impersonal where the strong dominate the weak. For anything good it must be first done with love, second, no laws must help people sin. It's one thing for one person to sin on their own, its another thing for the goverment to "help" them. This would involve taking lives. That's why Pope Benedict XVI compared the abortion industry and the HHS mandate to the nazi's. Well that and the Nazi's purposely passed laws knowing the Catholic church couldn't follow them, effectively shutting down many Catholic businesses.


Here's an interesting point. There have been 40 days for Life going on all over the world. Many people have been arrested simply for praying and protesting......has ANYONE seen this on tv? I haven't. But that also might be because I don't follow the news very closely.

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Oct 16th 2012 new

(Quote) Mary-486033 said: Obama - America's Most Biblically-Hostile U. S. President - www.wallbuilders.com.
(Quote) Mary-486033 said: Obama - America's Most Biblically-Hostile U. S. President - www.wallbuilders.com

Religious Group Threatens to Pull Support for Obama - www.youtube.com

Coalition of African American Pastors Condemn Obama's Same-Sex Marriage Switch (This group called Obama "Judas") - www.youtube.com

Bishop E.W. Jackson Message to Black Christians - www.youtube.com

Bishop E.W. Jackson calling Christians and Jews for mass EXODUS from Democratic Party - www.youtube.com
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Mary, the one below is AMAZING.

www.youtube.com

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Oct 16th 2012 new

(Quote) Laura-56149 said: (Quote) Shannan-733493 said: I'm aware of this. :-) I'm well infor...
(Quote) Laura-56149 said:

Quote:
Shannan-733493 said:

I'm aware of this. :-) I'm well informed folks. I understand that many of you hate President Obama and I'm aware of these lawsuit, and I'm aware that one bishop (the Springfield Illinois bishop, not the conference of bishops, and not my bishop) has gone so far as to virtually say Vote for Mitt Romney or burn in hell. Personally, I think that is inappropriate. I'm not trying to convince you all to vote for Obama. I know that is not going to happen. I'm just asking you to tone down your harsh rhetoric.

Peace.




I have been in these forums a very long time, Shannan, and have NEVER once read that someone hated President Obama. People are against the intrinsic evil he promotes as is described in the Ten Commandments and the Catholic Church. However, I was also here when President Bush was in office and was completely appalled at the name calling of our then president by the Liberal members. Since then many of them have left because that type of name calling isn't tolerated. We have forum monitors, so please don't feel the responsibility of having to ask people to tone it down. They do a great job. This particular thread is about how we can get Romney/Ryan elected so I don't really understand why you want to be in this thread unless you are wanting to stir up trouble by your comments. There are other enjoyable forum rooms that have nothing to do with politics.

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...you are right, but that is the problem if people disagree with Obama and the fact that he is persecuting us and our freedoms or promoting abortions, etc.... than the person hates him or is racist....God help us. Actually, I think God is because the black protestant Bishops are now speaking up about leaving the democrat party and not supporting Obama now too....they can't call them racist! Indeed, in this video they explain how they are NOT haters even though they are being accused but that it is because of their love, etc....

www.youtube.com

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Oct 16th 2012 new

(Quote) Marissa-529206 said: I think we need to pray, just pray and pray and pray. I've stopped calling my Republican ac...
(Quote) Marissa-529206 said:

I think we need to pray, just pray and pray and pray. I've stopped calling my Republican actually. I couldn't believe that some people are so blinded by their committment to their party that they cannot see what is happening. Because of that I've decided that from now on, I'm a Catholic. Not a republican or democrat, but a Catholic first. No part of my mind or body is controlled by anything but my beliefs on justice, realistic expectations and personal responsibility. I think if we can convince people to start thinking separately from their party lines they will see more clearly.

When I heard that Barack Obama was the only senator to vote in favour of not providing life-saving treatments for babies that survived abortion.....I knew that there was something disturbingly wrong with him. Even people who believed in being pro-choice did not vote for that, the practice is so horrific. I had to ask myself.....How could someone vote for that? Then when he commented negatively that when people were frightened they turned to guns and religion....I understood. He reveals more and more about himself over time.

Regarding the HHS mandate. It begs the question. The church has explained to him they CANNOT follow the law. So why will he allow the Amish to be exempted but not the catholics? It can be only two answers.....Either.....he doesn't understand the Catholics, or he doesn't care that Catholics can't follow it. If he understands that it affects the Catholics and that Catholics can't follow it......then there must be some reason that he doesn't mind Catholics will have to violate the law because of their conscious OR give up their religion. What does he expect us to choose?


If he doesn't understand the Catholics.....why does he not discuss it with the bishops? Why does he insist on telling bishops that they have the power to change their requirements?

If he doesn't CARE that the Catholics can't follow it....why does he not care? What does that say about how he makes decisions? What is his goal, if it does not include Catholics? Which it obviously doesn't, because if he was worried about the law being able to serve everyone, why is the Cahtolic church absent? Catholic hospitals are non-profit. All their profit goes towards treating more people. Catholic institutions are a major force in society. What does he gain by these being absent. Well, society loses alot. But his administration would gain alot though. These are just my thoughts....I realize that they are simply a practice of logic.

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Wonderful post, Marissa! I have been voting that way for years! I am a Catholic first. I look at each candidates views on life first because everything else is negotiable.

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Oct 16th 2012 new

Homily on Religious Liberty

www.youtube.com

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Oct 16th 2012 new

(Quote) Laura-695247 said: That's pretty ironic considering Patricia posted 8 times on the other thread, Mary po...
(Quote) Laura-695247 said:



That's pretty ironic considering Patricia posted 8 times on the other thread, Mary posted 15 times, Cheryl posted 15 times and you posted on the other thread 4 times!

Sorry, I thought segregation was illegal:o)


You guys make me LOL literally!!!! Thank you!

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Did you read my post? The other thread was MOCKING this thread. Cathy even said she was trying to get it locked. Did you read it? Nobody on this thread is mocking anyone else, we are trying to find ways to get Romney elected. Why does that bother you so much? I wrote you a very nice message welcoming you to the Catholic religion etc. never got a reply back but continue to see you trying to stir up trouble in the forums. Now I wonder what your true agenda is for being here.

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