Devoted to discussion pertaining to those issues which are specifically relevant to people 45+. Topics must have a specific perspective of people in this age group for it to be on topic.
The story of Abraham and Sarah is told in chapters 11-25 of the book of Genesis.
Learn More:Abraham & Sarah
Agreed. He may not have been married to a woman, but I would contend that he definitely maintained a long-term relationship or commitment with his vocation.
I would venture to say that maintaining a long-term relationship/commitment to a vocation or career is vastly different from creating and maintaining a long-term relationship with a person of the opposite gender. I think this is comparing apples and oranges.
hey folks. thanks for replies.
I do think it is very important to realize that this post is utterly not about me at all. I am not in the running currently, other than for 'mere' friendship--which is the way to start, is it not?--because of my situation.
I am posting this for the sake of all you out there who may be on either the giving or receiving end of the equation.
Yes, I am inordinately prideful. But I can at least 'boast' that this thread wasn't started as a means of telling the ladies, "Hey girls, give a guy a chance." I'll come back and do that when Rome lets me give smooches!!! LOL
My situation is why I am only on here for one month.....................then, poof......away i go!
Hi John, some people find it hard to meet others or may have been in committed relationships, devoted their lives to others like you stated you have been a father 20 times over and have moved on. It's how we lead our lives, most people on here would like to start with a friendship because that is the foundation for a great relationship whether it be just friends or more committed.
I find it interesting that you will be gone in a month, do you truly want to start down this path. Good Luck to you and yes you will find the right person.
Thank you for you comments. We need God, that is a given... but I am with you, I don't need a wife, but I want one. But the right one, a Holy woman. But then again, I can get along without one, but a good, Holy woman I do need to be a full man, for a good Holy woman can only improve me, because of the complimentary relations that God so designed.... I guess what I am saying when I say I do not need, well to be a full man, I do need, but I can survive without one... Whatever God has planned I will submit to.... Who knows but He!
God bless you always,
not really reading replies. this was just to offer some thoughts for whoever..............
i have scanned a couple recently, though.
regarding older vocations.......at the monastery--we were perhaps an exception--we often gave older vocations a try. we did not decide beforehand that it couldn't work. sometimes it did very nicely. we actually inspired at least one other community to accept the fact that not all older men looking into monastic life were automatically 'solemnly professed bachelors'.
and as was mentioned, those who could not adjust to community life, could find vocational fulfillment in diocesan priesthood or some other less community oriented vocation. the point is that we did not generalize that, if you were older, you'd never make it............some communities do have an automatic cut off age and they hold to it rigorously. but that is their mode...............
i didn't really read the 'apples and oranges' post much more than to quickly scan. but to link Catholic religious life--and especially a cloistered community life--with a secular vocation is not correct. superficially, they can seem similar, in a couple aspects. but that is the end. no comparison. that is truly to compare apples and oranges. the difference between authentic vocation and secular career is absolutely massive, divinely so.
as far as a former religious criticizing her husband as being a sign that religious life could never be a prep for a relationship--many things could be said...........but just this: i know of so many couples who do little more than bicker--who have been together for a long time. many tales of people married until death, who really couldn't stand one another. and these are just a few examples of people i know personally.........it is very clear that those who have been in relationships are hardly experts at it. this is why we live in times of unprecedented shattered families.
if you have been in relationships before--as i have also--or have been in religious life, or have been married, in no way is that a sign of great emotional maturity and give and take spirit.
until we attain heaven, all of us...all of us--yes even those who have been in relationships, or have been married, or divorced--will be prone to selfishness and unkindness, immaturity and the unwillingness to yield. I have seen this in both religious life and marriage.
funny. some have thought that i started this thread to advertise myself.
That is totally not the case. I started it just to mention that it is false--i assert--for anyone on cm to dismiss off hand anyone who has never been married as unable to live that life.
i have done this for you folks, that's all.
those in relationships have proven tragically well that they too are lacking in relationship skills, even if they can stick it out.
I am leaving cm in a couple weeks.
I just like to offer reflections to people for them to chew on, even if they do not bear upon my particular circumstance of life.
I have read here that some seekers on CM look askance at an older person who has never been married (i.e. someone who is not divorced or widowed)
For example, I have seen things like.......
1. such a person would not be able at an older age to adjust to living with another person, because (s)he has lived for him/herself for all these years (Yes, I actually read that here--yes.)
That is absolutely unbelievable, and anyone who is older and single, and who has read that, should be offended at being accused of a lifetime of self-absorption...........
Now, I should add that there can be a challenge in this regard for an older person to adjust to the give and take, being perhaps more set in their ways. So I fully acknowledge that.
I will just use myself as an example: I realize I am a pretty unusual 'apple' here on CM..............I have just spent over 22 years as a cloistered monk in an Eastern Catholic monastery. I have never been married, obviously, though I hope to be, once Rome permits it. Do you know the give and take required to live such a life? There is no vacation, no day off, no opportunity to just take off to blow off steam..If you have an interpersonal challenge, you DO NOT shun the other, but forgive instantly and carry on and pray for one another. There is no room for ignoring or shouting at another. The give and take, the little humiliations you receive from GOOD, HOLY people make the monastic life anything but a life of self absorption. As a cloistered monk, there is no opportunity to get out of the aquarium you share...with many different temperaments. There is virtually no such thing as free time--and what there is, is part of a very tight schedule, all of which is obligatory.
I was Director of Vocations, Director of the Retreat House, Assistant Superior, Assistant Novice Master, Novice Master, Finance Officer (and most enjoyably, chicken keeper!!) at various times over 22 years. You could say that I have been a father 20 times over. I know what it is like to mentor younger or older adults who give you 'pie in the face'. And do you reject them. NO, you love them and embrace them.........
I say this not to sound arrogant (I am arrogant already, so don't worry. I know!). But I just want to caution people from making generalizations about an older person who has never been married. ESPECIALLY in the assumption that they are now just too wrapped up in themselves to really love another person. Careful careful...............
As a final note on No. 1., I would like to mention that, in my vocational work, older vocations needed to be screened with a bit more caution. Why? Because there is a danger for such to be 'solemnly professed bachelors', unable to adapt to the rigorous give and take and forgiveness needed for monastic life. So I DO understand the concerns in this matter
Other things said are like this............
2. someone who is older and unmarried has not developed the skills necessary to have a serious relationship leading to marriage, whereas someone who is divorced or widowed, or who has experienced long term relationships really knows the ropes and what it takes. They are relationship pros, so to speak.
As with my experience with younger and older vocational prospects who have gone from pillar to post in their journey, I would actually be concerned about the ability to live the give and take of marriage in the case of one who has had serial failures in relationships. That is not a demonstration of skills in relationship; perhaps it is the opposite, in fact. In my vocational work, the serial monk was not considered very hopeful. 'Why has he not been able to settle into a committed form of religious life?' I have known many, and they did not work out....
I am not accusing such people--some of whom have been unjustly treated in relationships--of being bad people. And we should hope that 'relationship so-called pros' would also not make blanket assumptions about an older person who has never been married.
Remember the seven Capital Vices: Pride, Envy, Avarice, Anger, Lust, Gluttony, and Sloth. ME and you are all of these as a result of original sin. Yes, even those who have been in serial relationships. We all need forgiveness and and all should be given a chance. You might be the loser.
You are all in my heartfelt prayers before our Eucharistic Lord
I think you make many valid points.
People who have preconceived notions regarding the never married are just that, preconceived notions.
Just because one has never married does not mean that they do not know about relationships whether it be with the opposite sex or the younger generation.
I have never been married and yet I have many friends as well as many "adopted" nieces and nephews who have filled my life and taught me a great deal on the growth process from childhood into adulthood.
When two people fall in love to get married, it is the same for whether you have never been married, divorced, widowed. It is the blending of two lives, two personalities and two souls that have their own "issues" (issues does not necessarily mean bad.) It is taking time to discern, work at and see if this is who God has chosen to spend the rest of your life with and hopefully bring you to Heaven.
I have to laugh, especially people that have been divorced that have such a negative look at never married's. If they were all so great in the relationship department they would still be married
My motto that I developed on CM is take the best and leave the rest.
Be cautious at the beginning because it is still on line dating and do not leap quickly but discern and take things slow at the beginning.
Remember one thing, it is better to be single and living alone than to be married and... (I will let others feel in the dots based on what their experiences have been.)
I do think it sounds weird saying, "don't need", but you are right to be fulfilled we need. I think the big difference and you hit on it by saying, we can survive without a spouse. I have friends that I see going from man to man or woman to woman, never really taking time to realize that they can be happy on their own, I don't think you can bring anything to a relationship if you are so "needy". I want to be with someone because they make be a better person, not because I just want someone to have around. Hope that makes sense and doesn't sound horrible. Anyway I'm just resaying I think that most of us learn that as we "grow-up", or at least I pray most do. Ok, Football time, GO SAINTS....
Have a good day, Nora
Mary, thanks. I just came onto cm just as a means of seeing what folks like this think about and talk about; what their expectations are, etc. to do that i had to create a profile though.......................
all my previous girlfriends were before my conversion in 1988; so both they and i were on a different level. in 89 i entered the monastery...
it is so true, what we are saying: i will simply never accept the premise that someone who has been through one or more failed marriage(s), or through several failed non-marital relationships....has what it takes to live the give and take of marriage successfully. I will certainly seek someone who has never been married or who is widowed.
But either way
and NORA, this ties into what you say (I think), I have learned very well how to live without constant female companionship. I have doubts that I will ever find a woman who would want to marry this beanpole anyway. So be it, though I hope to be married. It is very possible to be very happy and single. How many so called happy couples (with skills in relationships!!??) are very lonely and unhappy, bored and tired of each other. Many many. Serial failures................so sad. At least a little puppy dog will always love you--now that's a companion, eh??!!