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This room is for the discussion of current events,cultural issues and politics especially in relation to Catholic values.

Saint Thomas More was martyred during the Protestant Reformation for standing firm in the Faith and not recognizing the King of England as the Supreme Head of the Church.
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Nov 19th 2012 new

(Quote) Paul-866591 said: Actually, Charles, it goes back to before WWII. The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem (Hitler'...
(Quote) Paul-866591 said:

Actually, Charles, it goes back to before WWII. The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem (Hitler's real pope) was virulently anti-Jewish and suggested and helped develop the Reich's "Final Solution.)

He was the spear head of the extreme wing of Islam. The problem is basically, internally and a directly a problem within Islam itself.

The bumbling and stumbling of America's foreign policy since then under both Democratic and Republican Administrations merely added fuel to the fire. Even without that, the problem would still exist. And it would (and will) exist even if Israel had never been created or if it should disappear.

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Paul, what do you think is the solution to the problem of the "extreme wing of Islam"? What do you think the U.S. govt. should be doing regarding it? Do you think any other country in the world would stand with us in doing anything (other than Israel)? I would be interested in hearing your opinion (or anyone else's here).

Nov 19th 2012 new

(Quote) Gustavo-764558 said: (Quote) Cheryl-409772 said: ....
(Quote) Gustavo-764558 said:
Quote:
Cheryl-409772 said:





...and just for the record Gustavo...because I don't have time to TEACH you....the economy is NOT on the mend....we have posted a plethora of threads of the companies now laying off post election and my sister's company is one of them...her husband already loss his job. EVERYone in my family had jobs under Bush...and before another liberal tries to blame him for Obama ruining this country...he had both houses his first two years in office. The real unemployment numbers are in now post election and it ain't pretty.



As one of the unemployed...I can't stand hearing from these liberals. The millions of babies dying from Obama and planned parenhood and GE, his buddy who didn't pay any taxes in 2010 thank you though for your support....not the unemployed...but they do. WARS? Are you kidding? What stone have you been living under....Lybia....Benghzi where he left four of our men to die and then lied to us about it for two weeks, etc. The entire congress was told that there were weopons of mass destruction after they attacked us....and you didn't see any more attacks under him either but now we have a plethora of them and the middle east is in crisis...but don't worry he is sending our tax dollars to the terrorist...you support that, right.




Wow, you're comparing 4 deaths in Benghazi to NUMEROUS thousands of casualties in 2 failed, immoral, illegal wars in Iraq and Afghanistan???

And Obama lied to us?? BUSH lied to us, the

UN and the world about weapons of mass destruction. At least I can sleep soundly at night knowing they were found...wait, they weren't.

It's always a good idea to go to war so long as it's someone else's kid who comes back maimed, psychologically damaged or in a flag-drapped coffin.
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What about Lybia...was that legal...endorsed by the congress when Obama sent forces in? NO! Democrats are no better than repbublicans...but they do get awards for absolutely nothing aparently. However, they are far worse in so many ways. Obama has leaked important intelligence that has hurt our men....by the way any idiot or kid playing a war game would know if you tell a country when you are pulling out then the citizens there will join up with the opposition...our poor men in Afganistan now being fired on by the people they think are supposed to be on their side. The Taliban is far WORSE now in the middle east and poor Israel is having to defend itself against attacks now again...because the Taliban think Obama is their buddy. We may even find that our weapons went to them in Lybia. At any rate, both parties stink at foreign affairs, but the democrats are far worse and pure evil in so many ways...advocating that even babies born alive can be murdered in addition to partial birth abortions and abortions...you know...I don't even get this....once there are two bodies seperated...their excuse no longer stands, but Obama voted to kill them three times when an Illinois senator...he has done absolutely nothing while in office except make killing babies a goal. ANd finally George Bush never lied....he never told us that we WERE NOT under attack when we WERE under attack! He never locked up a poor guy for free speech to cover his own behind and went in front of the UN and on to a plethora of talk shows and continued to lie, lie, lie.

Nov 19th 2012 new

(Quote) Paul-866591 said: Why keep spouting Democrat talking points. The morality of both the Iraq and Afgha...
(Quote) Paul-866591 said:

Why keep spouting Democrat talking points.

The morality of both the Iraq and Afghanistan wars has been argued among theologians since day one. The general consensus is that they probably qualified as just. I don't know about Afghanistan, but as far as Iraq is concerned, all Bush Jr. did was finish the job his father should have.

The Church laws allow Capital Punishment. So you are in no position to claim their are immoral. Even Pope JP II, who expressed as his personal opinion and not speaking as Pope that in modern society the need for Capital punishment is greatly diminished, DID NOT go so far as to say that it is immoral. Where do you get your authority to declare them as immoral acts. You are perfectly free to oppose execution but you have no basis to declare it to be immoral.

It drives me absolutely crazy when people say the Bush tax cuts only benefited the rich, because it is pure unadulterated rubbish. As a result of the Bush cuts millions of people in the lower income brackets were removed from the income tax rolls altogether. That is a 100% tax cut. Many oif them received even more than that because through other credits they are entitled to, they receive a rebate of the SS and Medicare taxes they pay. No one in their right mind can call that a neglect of the poor.

The majority of income earners had their taxes cut by an average of 33%. And the rich only received an average cut of 10%.

There is no doubt that if the rich had received only a 1% cut, the dollars they would save would be larger than for most taxable income earners. But the dollars they save mean a heck of a lot less to them than the dollars most people saved.

Even more telling. After the tax cuts the percentage of all personal income taxes collected that was paid by the rich has reached the highest level since before WWII. So even though they received a 10% cut, they paid more than ever before.

When, long before you were born, tax rates for the rich were as high as 92%, Government official data shows that on average the rich paid 33% of their income in Federal income tax. Since the Bush cuts the rate has dropped marginally, but the rich still pay an average of close to 1/3rd. of their income in tax.

Chances are that you like most people paid Uncle 10% or less of your income in Federal Income taxes.

Envy the rich all you want, but you cannot rationally argue that Bush's tax cuts neglected the poor and were immoral.

Somehow, I don't think facts will sway you in any way. But your distortion of reality cannot go unchallenged.

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More liberal logic, if the bush tax cuts only benefitted the rich, then why is obama not advocating that they simply expire? Even he is saying that taxes would raise for everybody if they simply expire. Hmmm...liberal logic=illogical Capain Kirk!

Nov 19th 2012 new

(Quote) Paul-866591 said: Even worse, the CIA's involvement in removing the Shah.
(Quote) Paul-866591 said:

Even worse, the CIA's involvement in removing the Shah.

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That is what I was going to say. Thanks to Jimmy Carter ousting the Shah and allowing the Ayatollah Khomeini to get his foot back in the door and establishing the radical islam to fester.

Nov 19th 2012 new

(Quote) Ron-481546 said: That is what I was going to say. Thanks to Jimmy Carter ousting the Shah and allowing ...
(Quote) Ron-481546 said:


That is what I was going to say. Thanks to Jimmy Carter ousting the Shah and allowing the Ayatollah Khomeini to get his foot back in the door and establishing the radical islam to fester.

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Democrats have been the worse leaders ever when it comes to foreign policy....the bullies don't fear them...so their bullying increases....I know I am simplifying it for the children.

Nov 19th 2012 new

YOu know what? I'm finally figuring out why the liberals slander Fox and hate them so much. I've been watching all the news since pre-election and now that it is post election the news stations that are going to report everything finally have....but they wouldn't pre-election and then there are those stations that won't period...ever....say anything negavtive about dems. Thus, they hate them because they report ALL the news...I'd never hear it otherwise....and some of that news doens't make their party look good. So, why even call the other stations news?

Nov 19th 2012 new

OH...and something else too...if liberals can convince the rest of the dems of this....they never hear the rest of the news...they get to live in that made up world of theirs.....good plan. It is easy to do too because there aren't a lot of stations that report all the news....they only have to convince them to hate Fox. Fox would have a heck of a harder time convincing people not to watch ALL the other stations....which are liberal and cover everthing up and pretty much lick the boots of the pres and hob nob with him rather than report on him.

Nov 19th 2012 new

(Quote) Patricia-29176 said:Paul, what do you think is the solution to the problem of the "extreme wing of Islam"...
(Quote) Patricia-29176 said:

Paul, what do you think is the solution to the problem of the "extreme wing of Islam"? What do you think the U.S. govt. should be doing regarding it? Do you think any other country in the world would stand with us in doing anything (other than Israel)? I would be interested in hearing your opinion (or anyone else's here).

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That is really a tough one, Trish.

On a very human basis without thought to morality in any way, one can almost wish that we could just go in and carpet bomb the whole area with Nukes from Iran to Saudi Arabia, plus Afghanistan and Pakistan.

We obviously cannot do that. But I do know we cannot solve the problem by bowing and scraping to them, showing cowardliness and appearing weak. Nor do we gain anything by pouring our hard earned money in gifts as we do to Egypt to the tune of about $2 billion/year and Israel up to $4 billion/yr.

We dismantled our "Radio Free" operations after the fall of the USSR. A similar program aimed at all the Arab countries would do a lot of good. Teaching the populations what freedom is really like. The listeners would then be able to compare what they have to what could be. It took a long time, but it worked where we used it before.

If we give money, it should only be on the condition that the recipient countries clean out all the wackos no matter where they are. Mosques should be no sanctuaries for the extremists.

Instead of cutting our military, we should strenghten it. And when something like Benghazi happens, there should be an immediate military response to punish the country that allowed it to happen.

Thomas Jefferson finally learned the lesson. For years the US paid tribute to the Barbary pirates. Jefferson finally got fed up and sent in the marines. It solved the problems for us and the other nations trading in the area.

We should stop listening to the environmental wackos who are a distinct crazy minority, but have gained power as if they knew what they were talking about. Develop our own oil resources. This country has enough oil to take care of the entire world's need for 100 years. BY developing those resources we will put pressure on those two bit countries that wield far more power than they really have.

Those would be just a start.

Nov 19th 2012 new

(Quote) Paul-866591 said: That is really a tough one, Trish. On a very human basis without thought to morali...
(Quote) Paul-866591 said:

That is really a tough one, Trish.

On a very human basis without thought to morality in any way, one can almost wish that we could just go in and carpet bomb the whole area with Nukes from Iran to Saudi Arabia, plus Afghanistan and Pakistan.

We obviously cannot do that. But I do know we cannot solve the problem by bowing and scraping to them, showing cowardliness and appearing weak. Nor do we gain anything by pouring our hard earned money in gifts as we do to Egypt to the tune of about $2 billion/year and Israel up to $4 billion/yr.

We dismantled our "Radio Free" operations after the fall of the USSR. A similar program aimed at all the Arab countries would do a lot of good. Teaching the populations what freedom is really like. The listeners would then be able to compare what they have to what could be. It took a long time, but it worked where we used it before.

If we give money, it should only be on the condition that the recipient countries clean out all the wackos no matter where they are. Mosques should be no sanctuaries for the extremists.

Instead of cutting our military, we should strenghten it. And when something like Benghazi happens, there should be an immediate military response to punish the country that allowed it to happen.

Thomas Jefferson finally learned the lesson. For years the US paid tribute to the Barbary pirates. Jefferson finally got fed up and sent in the marines. It solved the problems for us and the other nations trading in the area.

We should stop listening to the environmental wackos who are a distinct crazy minority, but have gained power as if they knew what they were talking about. Develop our own oil resources. This country has enough oil to take care of the entire world's need for 100 years. BY developing those resources we will put pressure on those two bit countries that wield far more power than they really have.

Those would be just a start.

--hide--


I totally agree with you that we should develp our own oil resources, also clean coal, also nuclear, etc. We need to become energy independent! And, I also agree about cutting down or out these billions of dollars to countries that could care less what the U.S. says and are fostering the terrorists unless they cooperate to some degree. And, I also agree that we need a stronger military - I think that is the best way we have of ensuring that we won't need to use it (hopefully).

The Radio Free Europe thought is interesting. In these days, one should be able to do that through the internet, but unfortunately these countries censor that. But, could they also block radio waves (I wouldn't think they could - but who knows what kind of hi-tech stuff is available now to jam something like that). In the long run, educating people tends to work. But, because these terrorists are so tied to radical Islam, I don't think something like this would work in this case (although it might help with the average citizen there, I think they are so controlled by their govts. and these Mullahs, I doubt that they could do anything. You know, I just hope this doesn't at some point end up being another Crusades - radical Islam vs. the free world (of all other religions). But, it wouldn't surprise me if it did end up there at some point down the line (based on the radical philosophy of Islam of forcible conversion or death of non-believers and Sharia law). I think it would be easier to get this under control now (although after what Obama has let happen the last 4 years, we are in a weaker position already). And, Muslim immigration has changed the face of Europe entirely - and I think will continue in this direction. (I wonder if the growing secularism of Europe has contributed to this). I think it will be an interesting 4 years under Obama re foreign events. I hope he has learned something from Benghazi other than how to do a coverup!

Nov 19th 2012 new

(Quote) Patricia-29176 said:I totally agree with you that we should develp our own oil resources, also clean coal, also nuc...
(Quote) Patricia-29176 said:

I totally agree with you that we should develp our own oil resources, also clean coal, also nuclear, etc. We need to become energy independent! And, I also agree about cutting down or out these billions of dollars to countries that could care less what the U.S. says and are fostering the terrorists unless they cooperate to some degree. And, I also agree that we need a stronger military - I think that is the best way we have of ensuring that we won't need to use it (hopefully).

The Radio Free Europe thought is interesting. In these days, one should be able to do that through the internet, but unfortunately these countries censor that. But, could they also block radio waves (I wouldn't think they could - but who knows what kind of hi-tech stuff is available now to jam something like that). In the long run, educating people tends to work. But, because these terrorists are so tied to radical Islam, I don't think something like this would work in this case (although it might help with the average citizen there, I think they are so controlled by their govts. and these Mullahs, I doubt that they could do anything. You know, I just hope this doesn't at some point end up being another Crusades - radical Islam vs. the free world (of all other religions). But, it wouldn't surprise me if it did end up there at some point down the line (based on the radical philosophy of Islam of forcible conversion or death of non-believers and Sharia law). I think it would be easier to get this under control now (although after what Obama has let happen the last 4 years, we are in a weaker position already). And, Muslim immigration has changed the face of Europe entirely - and I think will continue in this direction. (I wonder if the growing secularism of Europe has contributed to this). I think it will be an interesting 4 years under Obama re foreign events. I hope he has learned something from Benghazi other than how to do a coverup!

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Radio jamming was always and will continue to be a problem. Still, despite all the jamming , the "Radio Free" stations manged to get through.

The most important part of that process was winning the hearts of the common rabble to the point that they finally said enough to their leaders. That is what has to happen with the people of Islam.

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