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This room is for supportive and informative discussion about divorce and/or the annulment process. All posters must have been previously divorced or annulled.

Saint Eugene De Mazenod is patron of dysfunctional families & Saint Fabiola obtained a divorce from her first husband prior to devoting her life to charitable works.
Learn More: Saint Eugene De Mazenod and Saint Fabiola

I am new to catholicmatch, and as I read the profiles, I see many, many men stating their belief in Papal infallibility, yet not agreeing with the Pope's authority regarding sex outside of marriage and birth control. As stated, Papal Infallibility proclaims the Pope is preserved from the possibility of error[1] "when, in the exercise of his office as shepherd and teacher of all Christians, in virtue of his supreme apostolic authority, he defines a doctrine concerning faith or morals to be held by the whole Church".


Would love to understand from those with these beliefs how this reconciles. I am not judging, just thought it would be enlightening and interesting do discuss.

11/24/2012 new

(Quote) Jocelyn-917815 said: I am new to catholicmatch, and as I read the profiles, I see many, many men stating their belie...
(Quote) Jocelyn-917815 said:

I am new to catholicmatch, and as I read the profiles, I see many, many men stating their belief in Papal infallibility, yet not agreeing with the Pope's authority regarding sex outside of marriage and birth control. As stated, Papal Infallibility proclaims the Pope is preserved from the possibility of error[1] "when, in the exercise of his office as shepherd and teacher of all Christians, in virtue of his supreme apostolic authority, he defines a doctrine concerning faith or morals to be held by the whole Church".


Would love to understand from those with these beliefs how this reconciles. I am not judging, just thought it would be enlightening and interesting do discuss.

--hide--


This will be interesting

11/24/2012 new

Yes, I hope so!

11/25/2012 new

The pope is only infallible when speaking "ex cathedra". The last time this happened was 62 years ago, and the topic was the assumption of Mary.

The Wikipedia page on papal infallibility is very interesting. To quote: "In July 2005 Pope Benedict XVI stated during an impromptu address to priests in Aosta that: "The Pope is not an oracle; he is infallible in very rare situations, as we know".[18] His predecessor Pope John XXIII once remarked: "I am only infallible if I speak infallibly but I shall never do that, so I am not infallible".[19]"

Hope this helps.

11/25/2012 new

Fascinating! I have to investigate this furthur. I've always had trouble with infallibility because some popes in the past have indulged in activities that go against Church teachings. I can't see how they can do that if they're completely infallible. Some popes go against other's proclaimations (is that the right word?) which means to me that someone must be infallible. A law, in the Church, can't be OK on one instance and not another. I realize I don't have the wisdom to understand this but it doesn't make sense to me.

11/26/2012 new

Bryan is correct. The pope only infallible on matters of truth and faith when he is speaking from the Throne of Peter (Ex Cathedra). However, the whole point to having a pope is to ensure the teachings of Christ are known and followed. The teachings regarding chastity, fornication, adultery, etc. come from Christ himself and it is any sitting pope's duty to uphold this teaching.

So, Jocelyn, your question is a great one, even if it doesn't directly relate to the pope's infallability.

I, too, hope that others will chime in on this.

- Lisa Duffy

11/28/2012 new

I'm curious. Since it may only certain instances where the pope is infallible, should I change my profile about infallibity? If it isn't all-encompassing, I certaunly could believe it.

11/28/2012 new

I re-read my response and realized I had written somewhat hastily so I'd like to clarify my point...

The Pope is infallible in matters of faith and morals. So, if the Pope held a press conference tomorrow and said he believed all people should wear a certain style of shoe or have a specific hair cut he would not be speaking infallibly. That would be his opinion.

But he is infallible when it comes to speaking "ex-cathedra" regarding faith and morals. Here is a great quote from the New Advent site:

"Its present meaning was formally determined by theVatican Council, Sess. IV, Const. de Ecclesiâ Christi, c. iv: "We teach and define that it is a dogma Divinely revealed that the Roman pontiffwhen he speaks ex cathedra, that is when in discharge of the office of pastor and doctor of all Christians, by virtue of his supreme Apostolicauthority, he defines a doctrine regarding faith or morals to be held by the universal Church, by the Divine assistance promised to him inBlessed Peter, is possessed of that infallibility with which the Divine Redeemer willed that his Church should be endowed in defining doctrineregarding faith or morals, and that therefore such definitions of the Roman pontiff are of themselves and not from the consent of the Churchirreformable."

God bless!

Lisa

11/28/2012 new

heart This is a PERFECT example of why I only glance at the questions. Too often, when brought to discussion, there are misunderstandings. The questions are best used as a starting point for a conversation.

11/28/2012 new
I'm confused. So the pope is infallible in matters of faith and doctrine? What if they don't strictly follow Church doctrine? It has happened that they don't. What's ok and what's not? For example, popes in the past have indulged in fornication. We all know that's not ok. I'm totally ignorant about this. Since they're not defining Church doctrine when they've done that, it's not ok but human?
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