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Crazy Charismatics?

01/02/2013 new
What is the general attitude of the forum readers here towards the Catholic Charismatic Renewal, which has been embraced by three popes: Paul VI, John Paul II and our current pope Benedict XVI? There are several books written by church officials on the topic such as "Sober Intoxication of the Spirit: Filled With the Fullness of God" by Father Raniero Cantalamessa and "Healing in the Spirit of Jesus" by Father Peter Sanders. In my parish, anyone referred to as a "charismatic" is overtly ostracized. If the forum attitude is the same, then why the disconnect?
01/02/2013 new

As a foreward, I'm not Charismatic, nor will I ever be. I just don't find them to be my cup of tea.


Now that that's been said...


Part of the concensus concerning Charismatics stems from the fact that most people don't recognize that there are different sects among the Charismatics, causing them to oftem be lumped into a single group. And since some of these sects among Charismatics straddle the line between faithful Catholicism and Protestantism, and tend to draw more attention to themselves than the other sects, the other sects are seen as being guilty by association.


That's the simple answer to your question.


theheart

01/03/2013 new
I never thought about the existence of mini offshoots from within the movement, but I do think that it does have an ecumenical aspect to it... agreed. Maybe it is this movement which will help unify Christianity and bring it into the Catholic Church? I have often read Acts and Corinthians and wondered why those "gifts" and manifestations of the Holy Spirit that the early Christians embodied aren't still predominant within the Church culture. We all know about Pentecost, as it was the birth date of the Catholic Church. It was a miraculous event and Mary was present with Peter, our first Pope. I've heard a nun refer to Mary as a Charismatic. It would make sense as the Holy Spirit is often referred to as her spouse.
01/03/2013 new

wink I'll never "say it ain't so" about someone else's experience with God or the Holy Spirit, but, that being said, it seems to me ( a convert) that the Catholic Church goes an awfully long way towards being able to proove that visions are real, and verifying miracles. So, I just wonder how The Church could possibl verify all the experiences of the Charismatics...and maybe that is why they tend to be ostrecized by may Catholics.

scratchchin Frankly, one of the things that drew me to the Catholic Church is that tey really do go a long way in looking into something before they will accept it and publicly give it a thumbs up. I think that that the slow and careful acceptance is what gives The Church the credibility that it enjoys even now.


Whic leads me to beieve that if they were to simply accept of embrace every experience of every Charismatic, there would be a huge risk to The Church's credibiity. So, I don't think they should step into that water. angel

01/06/2013 new

(Quote) Joe-660568 said: What is the general attitude of the forum readers here towards the Catholic Charismatic Renewal, which has...
(Quote) Joe-660568 said: What is the general attitude of the forum readers here towards the Catholic Charismatic Renewal, which has been embraced by three popes: Paul VI, John Paul II and our current pope Benedict XVI? There are several books written by church officials on the topic such as "Sober Intoxication of the Spirit: Filled With the Fullness of God" by Father Raniero Cantalamessa and "Healing in the Spirit of Jesus" by Father Peter Sanders. In my parish, anyone referred to as a "charismatic" is overtly ostracized. If the forum attitude is the same, then why the disconnect?
--hide--

I can't speak for anyone else, but in my experience with the so-called "charismatic community," nothing edifying comes out of it.

All of the "charismatic liturgies" I attended typically culminated in hysteria, irreverence toward the Eucharist and sacred objects and consecrated persons, defiance of the rubrics, general ad libidum and weirdness, and what I can only describe as "touchy-feely hokey-pokey gyrations."

I don't know what the three above-named Popes saw/see in the movement (or if they even embrace the movement at all), though, I can only imagine it's not what I saw and experienced if they have chosen to sanction these "charismatic" groups.

01/06/2013 new

(Quote) Joe-660568 said: What is the general attitude of the forum readers here towards the Catholic Charismatic Renewal, which has...
(Quote) Joe-660568 said: What is the general attitude of the forum readers here towards the Catholic Charismatic Renewal, which has been embraced by three popes: Paul VI, John Paul II and our current pope Benedict XVI? There are several books written by church officials on the topic such as "Sober Intoxication of the Spirit: Filled With the Fullness of God" by Father Raniero Cantalamessa and "Healing in the Spirit of Jesus" by Father Peter Sanders. In my parish, anyone referred to as a "charismatic" is overtly ostracized. If the forum attitude is the same, then why the disconnect?
--hide--


Having attended a school that is known for being "Charismatic HQ", I have had quite a bit of experience with charismatic prayer groups and the like. The school is also known for being very traditional and in line with the Church.

Keep in mind too that I was also baptized in an Extraordinary Form parish...

What I see go wrong in some charismatic circles is the same thing that I see go wrong some very traditional circles: there is an attitude amond some members that their way is the right way, or that they have some sort of special "in" when it comes to God.

We dealt with that kind of thinking over fifteen hundred years ago, and there is no need for it today, no matter which part of the Church you reside in.

In any case, in my experience with those that identify as charismatic, yet are careful to stay clearly within the bounds of Holy Mother Church, tend many times to also attend very reverent and "traditional" Masses! The leaders of the charismatic group at my school were also frequently seen at the Extraordinary Form Mass that we held regularly on campus.

In other words: I am open to the Charismatic Movement, so long as those involved rely on the teachings and guidance of the Church, and are careful not to let the means (prayer groups, gifts of the Holy Spirit, etc) distact from the end (Union with God and His Church).

Pax,

Dean

01/07/2013 new
(Quote) Dean-927722 said: (Quote) Joe-660568 said: What is the general attitude of the forum readers here towards the Cath...
(Quote) Dean-927722 said:

Quote:
Joe-660568 said: What is the general attitude of the forum readers here towards the Catholic Charismatic Renewal, which has been embraced by three popes: Paul VI, John Paul II and our current pope Benedict XVI? There are several books written by church officials on the topic such as "Sober Intoxication of the Spirit: Filled With the Fullness of God" by Father Raniero Cantalamessa and "Healing in the Spirit of Jesus" by Father Peter Sanders. In my parish, anyone referred to as a "charismatic" is overtly ostracized. If the forum attitude is the same, then why the disconnect?


Having attended a school that is known for being "Charismatic HQ", I have had quite a bit of experience with charismatic prayer groups and the like. The school is also known for being very traditional and in line with the Church.

Keep in mind too that I was also baptized in an Extraordinary Form parish...

What I see go wrong in some charismatic circles is the same thing that I see go wrong some very traditional circles: there is an attitude amond some members that their way is the right way, or that they have some sort of special "in" when it comes to God.

We dealt with that kind of thinking over fifteen hundred years ago, and there is no need for it today, no matter which part of the Church you reside in.

In any case, in my experience with those that identify as charismatic, yet are careful to stay clearly within the bounds of Holy Mother Church, tend many times to also attend very reverent and "traditional" Masses! The leaders of the charismatic group at my school were also frequently seen at the Extraordinary Form Mass that we held regularly on campus.

In other words: I am open to the Charismatic Movement, so long as those involved rely on the teachings and guidance of the Church, and are careful not to let the means (prayer groups, gifts of the Holy Spirit, etc) distact from the end (Union with God and His Church).

Pax,

Dean

--hide--
I wholeheartely agree, Dean. I notice that sometimes the Charismatics forget to pray the rosary and almost forget about Mary and instead rely on outward physical expression instead of strict adherence to Magisterial authority. However, I'll tell you that I know of friends that were cured of terminal cancer through going to charismatic masses and conventions. (The tests came back pre-op as though the cancer just disappeared.) I also know of one case where the prayer group came to an elderly family friend's hospital room as he was drawing heavy doses of morphine and looked like he had 24 hours left to live and was miraculously cured. His son told me that the UCSF doctors had to "rewrite the medical textbooks" after his sudden recovery. Annnnnnnd what's wrong with a little extracurricular worship?
01/07/2013 new

(Quote) Joe-660568 said: What is the general attitude of the forum readers here towards the Catholic Charismatic Renewal, which has...
(Quote) Joe-660568 said: What is the general attitude of the forum readers here towards the Catholic Charismatic Renewal, which has been embraced by three popes: Paul VI, John Paul II and our current pope Benedict XVI? There are several books written by church officials on the topic such as "Sober Intoxication of the Spirit: Filled With the Fullness of God" by Father Raniero Cantalamessa and "Healing in the Spirit of Jesus" by Father Peter Sanders. In my parish, anyone referred to as a "charismatic" is overtly ostracized. If the forum attitude is the same, then why the disconnect?
--hide--


what a nice group of loving christians in your parish. overt ostracism is a fine way to treat others. so is discounting the judgment of 3 popes! what's with that?


charismatic worship is not a style of worship that appeals much to me, but i admire their fervor and love. ever read the acts of the apostles? put down the rule book try it some time. you may be surprised how closely charismatic worship resembles the spirit and practices of the early church. finally, charismatic worship keeps many people in the church who would otherwise wander off to an evangelical denomination. what's wrong with that?


as people of faith, we must always be on guard against pride, fault-finding, and ego. these are the subtle sins that sandbag the devoutly faithful.

01/07/2013 new

(Quote) Chelsea-743484 said: . . . I don't know what the three above-named Popes saw/see in the movement (or ...
(Quote) Chelsea-743484 said:

. . .


I don't know what the three above-named Popes saw/see in the movement (or if they even embrace the movement at all), though, I can only imagine it's not what I saw and experienced if they have chosen to sanction these "charismatic" groups.

--hide--


maybe it's time to find out.


(for the record, i tend to agree with you. charismatic is not my worship style, but done right, it must have many good characteristics for the people to whom it appeals. otherwise three pontiffs wouldn't have praised it.)


Dove

01/09/2013 new
(Quote) Joe-660568 said: What is the general attitude of the forum readers here towards the Catholic Charismatic Renewal, which has been embr...
(Quote) Joe-660568 said: What is the general attitude of the forum readers here towards the Catholic Charismatic Renewal, which has been embraced by three popes: Paul VI, John Paul II and our current pope Benedict XVI? There are several books written by church officials on the topic such as "Sober Intoxication of the Spirit: Filled With the Fullness of God" by Father Raniero Cantalamessa and "Healing in the Spirit of Jesus" by Father Peter Sanders.

In my parish, anyone referred to as a "charismatic" is overtly ostracized. If the forum attitude is the same, then why the disconnect?
--hide--


Google JP 2 and his message on May 30, 1998. It was an invitation to all to be open to the movement of the Spirit. That being open is called a Baptism in the Spirit. It is not something new, it is an awakening of the gifts of the Spirit conferred on us at Confirmation.

As with anything generated by God, satan does his best to come against it. Unfortunately, there are a few persons who are nuts and have given the movement a bad name. I have been to many charismatic mass's where the reverence for God, adoration of Jesus in the Eucharist and the authority of the Church were embraced and exhibited in a profund way.

Yes, I am a Charismatic and have been since 1997. That encounter with the Living God in a profound, tangible way changed my life forever and I am grateful beyond belief that God reached out to such an undeserving person. I can tell you that up until the moment the Spirit fell, I thought all the people around me were weirdos too. Now I see the Acts of the Apostles come alive right in front of me. Who am I to question what God does with His Spirit?
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