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This room is for discussion related to learning about the faith (Catechetics), defense of the Faith (Apologetics), the Liturgy and canon law, motivated by a desire to grow closer to Christ or to bring someone else closer.

Saint Augustine of Hippo is considered on of the greatest Christian thinkers of all time and the Doctor of the Church.
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Jan 15th 2013 new

(Quote) Mike-41230 said: Pope John Paul II, Pope Benedict, Fr. Cantalamessa and others may have been or are accepting of cha...
(Quote) Mike-41230 said:

Pope John Paul II, Pope Benedict, Fr. Cantalamessa and others may have been or are accepting of charismatics. But did they or anyone from the Vatican ever talk or write about "speaking in tongues"?

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Below is a link to a Youtube video of Fr. Cantalamessa speaking in which he references speaking in tongues (briefly). I suspect there are more references on the net or in his excellent book "Sober Intoxication of the Spirit". This video is about 5 minutes (listen carefully as Fr. Cantalamessa speaks English with an Italian accent.)

www.youtube.com

Jan 15th 2013 new

(Quote) Mike-41230 said: Pope John Paul II, Pope Benedict, Fr. Cantalamessa and others may have been or are accepting of cha...
(Quote) Mike-41230 said:

Pope John Paul II, Pope Benedict, Fr. Cantalamessa and others may have been or are accepting of charismatics. But did they or anyone from the Vatican ever talk or write about "speaking in tongues"?

--hide--
Charismatics are for sure a part of our Church and have been since Pentecost. This article explains it all, with Bible passages to back it up and also a video of Pope John Pail II words on the Charismatics. Also you can get Baptised in the spirit again The Apostle's did. So also can any Catholic as far as the Catholic Church is concerned.

There are seven gifts of the Holy spirit in Charismatic movement and Saint Paul talks about them in the bible. Here is the link, Everyone should read it so we know the power of it and know when it is real or not.www.catholicbible101.com

Jan 15th 2013 new

(Quote) Thomas-699657 said: Charismatics are for sure a part of our Church and have been since Pentecost. This article expla...
(Quote) Thomas-699657 said:

Charismatics are for sure a part of our Church and have been since Pentecost. This article explains it all, with Bible passages to back it up and also a video of Pope John Pail II words on the Charismatics. Also you can get Baptised in the spirit again The Apostle's did. So also can any Catholic as far as the Catholic Church is concerned.

There are seven gifts of the Holy spirit in Charismatic movement and Saint Paul talks about them in the bible. Here is the link, Everyone should read it so we know the power of it and know when it is real or not.www.catholicbible101.com

--hide--
Has anyone been to a Baptism mass??? Everyone I went to, the Priest asked all in the Church to also renew there baptism, as he also asked the parents of the children. Come on you have to know the words the Priest uses do you reject Satan etc.

Jan 15th 2013 new
(Quote) Jerry-74383 said: I suspect more than a few have perceptions arising from seeing some of the outlandish fringe (or...
(Quote) Jerry-74383 said:



I suspect more than a few have perceptions arising from seeing some of the outlandish fringe (or at least I hope it is fringe) behavior, such as those who claim to be "speaking in tongues" while uttering sounds that are not understood by anyone present and which experts cannot identify as a known language.

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"These signs will accompany those who have believed: in My name they will cast out demons, they will speak with new tongues;

Mark 16:17 biggrin
Jan 15th 2013 new

(Quote) Patricia-29176 said: (Quote) Mike-41230 said: Pope John Paul II, Pope Benedict, Fr. Cantalame...
(Quote) Patricia-29176 said:

Quote:
Mike-41230 said:

Pope John Paul II, Pope Benedict, Fr. Cantalamessa and others may have been or are accepting of charismatics. But did they or anyone from the Vatican ever talk or write about "speaking in tongues"?




Below is a link to a Youtube video of Fr. Cantalamessa speaking in which he references speaking in tongues (briefly). I suspect there are more references on the net or in his excellent book "Sober Intoxication of the Spirit". This video is about 5 minutes (listen carefully as Fr. Cantalamessa speaks English with an Italian accent.)

www.youtube.com

--hide--

Thanks Patricia. I had to listen to Fr. Cantalamessa's video 4 times. If you listen to it around 57 seconds into the video Fr. Cantalamessa says "and they started speaking in other languages."

Fr. Cantalamessa is referring to Acts 2:4-12. Now just replace the word tongues in these verses below with the word languages and you will see that speaking in tongues in the time of the Apostles meant speaking in diverse languages.

Acts 2:4-12 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and they began to speak with divers tongues, according as the Holy Ghost gave them to speak. [5] Now there were dwelling at Jerusalem, Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven. [6] And when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded in mind, because that every man heard them speak in his own tongue. [7] And they were all amazed, and wondered, saying: Behold, are not all these, that speak, Galileans? [8] And how have we heard, every man our own tongue wherein we were born? [9] Parthians, and Medes, and Elamites, and inhabitants of Mesopotamia, Judea, and Cappadocia, Pontus and Asia, [10] Phrygia, and Pamphylia, Egypt, and the parts of Libya about Cyrene, and strangers of Rome, [11] Jews also, and proselytes, Cretes, and Arabians: we have heard them speak in our own tongues the wonderful works of God. [12] And they were all astonished, and wondered, saying one to another: What meaneth this?

In the times of the Apostles Pentecost or "the Fiftieth day" was a prominent feast in the calendar of ancient Israel celebrating the giving of the Law on Sinai wherein Israelites "out of every nation under heaven", that spoke different languages gathered in Jerusalem. Hence the Apostles spoke in different languages (different tongues) to bring the Word of Our Lord to the 3,000 at the Catholic Church's first Pentecost.

I do not think speaking in tongues in the time of the Apostles meant what it does these days. My aunt, who was over 90 years of age at the time and was a charismatic told me that "speaking in tongues" came into the Catholic Church in 1967 through members of the Pentecostal church.

That all said, nobody is saying that charismatics are not part of the Catholic Church.

Jan 16th 2013 new

Not to beat a dead horse but it just so happens that I dropped into this other Catholic forum that I go to last night and like Divine providence a member had just started this thread yesterday titled 'Saint Anthony of Padua Real Preacher of tongues'.

I'll just repost these posts from it.

--------------------------

First post

So I have read a lot about the Charismatic movement which advocates the speaking of tongues. Yet many times when someone claims that he was speaking in tongues, all that other people hear are just sounds that no one really knows what is being said.

Yet as I have read more about the life of saint Anthony I have noticed that he himself spoke in tongues, the difference is that his listeners actually understood what he was saying.

I am currently reading a book called Saint Anthony The Wonder Worker of Padua

In it is says in chapter 12 " Anthony The Father Of mystic Theology"

" While in Italy he preached in Italian; yet all the knowledge he possessed of that mellifluous tongue he got from his brief intercourse with the six six illiterate lay-brothers at the hospice in the solitude of Monte Paolo. While in France he preached in French, though he had never studied the language."

"Saint Anthony of Padua one of the chosen disciples and companions of Saint Francis, once preached in the Consistory before the Pope and his Cardinals; in which Consistory there were men of diverse nations- namely, Greeks, Latins, Slavs, and English and men speaking other diverse tongues. Fired by the Holy Ghost, so efficaciously, so devoutly, so subtly, so sweet, so clearly, and so plainly did Anthony set forth the word of God, that all they which were present at the Consistory, of whatever diverse tongues they were, clearly understood all his words distinctly, even as he had spoken in the languages of each man amongst them. And they were struck with amaze; and it seemed that the ancient miracle of the Apostles had been renewed, when at the time of the Pentecost they spoke by the virtue of the Holy Ghost in every tongue. And they said one to another, with admiration and awe: Z:' Is not he who preaches come out of Spain? And how do we hear in in his discourse every man of us the speech of his own land?' "


This seems to differ from others claiming to speak in tongues. Others have spoken in phrases that others do not understand, while when Saint Anthony did this, others clearly understood what he was saying.

End of first post.

--------------------------

Second post

Yes, this beautiful story is also included in the Fioretti, the Little Flowers of St Francis.

At another time, St Anthony preached to and was understood by the fishes, in a miracle that converted the whole town of Rimini.

He is one of my favorite saints.

End of second post.

--------------------------

Then the person that started the thread posted these two links.

Speaking in Tongues - A supernatural gift of the Holy Spirit
The Gift of Tongues - Speaking in ones native language while being understood by those of various languages.
www.miraclesofthesaints.com

The book 'Little flowers of Saint Francis'
www.ewtn.com

Jan 17th 2013 new
(Quote) Mike-41230 said: Not to beat a dead horse but it just so happens that I dropped into this other Catholic forum that I go to last n...
(Quote) Mike-41230 said:

Not to beat a dead horse but it just so happens that I dropped into this other Catholic forum that I go to last night and like Divine providence a member had just started this thread yesterday titled 'Saint Anthony of Padua Real Preacher of tongues'.

I'll just repost these posts from it.

--------------------------



First post



So I have read a lot about the Charismatic movement which advocates the speaking of tongues. Yet many times when someone claims that he was speaking in tongues, all that other people hear are just sounds that no one really knows what is being said.

Yet as I have read more about the life of saint Anthony I have noticed that he himself spoke in tongues, the difference is that his listeners actually understood what he was saying.

I am currently reading a book called Saint Anthony The Wonder Worker of Padua

In it is says in chapter 12 " Anthony The Father Of mystic Theology"



" While in Italy he preached in Italian; yet all the knowledge he possessed of that mellifluous tongue he got from his brief intercourse with the six six illiterate lay-brothers at the hospice in the solitude of Monte Paolo. While in France he preached in French, though he had never studied the language."

"Saint Anthony of Padua one of the chosen disciples and companions of Saint Francis, once preached in the Consistory before the Pope and his Cardinals; in which Consistory there were men of diverse nations- namely, Greeks, Latins, Slavs, and English and men speaking other diverse tongues. Fired by the Holy Ghost, so efficaciously, so devoutly, so subtly, so sweet, so clearly, and so plainly did Anthony set forth the word of God, that all they which were present at the Consistory, of whatever diverse tongues they were, clearly understood all his words distinctly, even as he had spoken in the languages of each man amongst them. And they were struck with amaze; and it seemed that the ancient miracle of the Apostles had been renewed, when at the time of the Pentecost they spoke by the virtue of the Holy Ghost in every tongue. And they said one to another, with admiration and awe: Z:' Is not he who preaches come out of Spain? And how do we hear in in his discourse every man of us the speech of his own land?' "


This seems to differ from others claiming to speak in tongues. Others have spoken in phrases that others do not understand, while when Saint Anthony did this, others clearly understood what he was saying.



End of first post.



--------------------------



Second post



Yes, this beautiful story is also included in the Fioretti, the Little Flowers of St Francis.

At another time, St Anthony preached to and was understood by the fishes, in a miracle that converted the whole town of Rimini.

He is one of my favorite saints.



End of second post.



--------------------------



Then the person that started the thread posted these two links.

Speaking in Tongues - A supernatural gift of the Holy Spirit
The Gift of Tongues - Speaking in ones native language while being understood by those of various languages.
www.miraclesofthesaints.com

The book 'Little flowers of Saint Francis'
www.ewtn.com

--hide--


Hi Mike,

The way I understand it is that when someone is speaking in tongues, there is another who is interpreting what is being said and it is used for the building up and edifying the Church. When we are praying in our prayer language, the Holy Spirit is praying with our spirit to the Heavenly Father because "we do not know how to pray as we ought."
Jan 17th 2013 new

(Quote) Joanna-615441 said: (Quote) Mike-41230 said: Not to beat a dead horse but it just so happens that I ...
(Quote) Joanna-615441 said:
Quote:
Mike-41230 said:

Not to beat a dead horse but it just so happens that I dropped into this other Catholic forum that I go to last night and like Divine providence a member had just started this thread yesterday titled 'Saint Anthony of Padua Real Preacher of tongues'.

I'll just repost these posts from it.

--------------------------



First post



So I have read a lot about the Charismatic movement which advocates the speaking of tongues. Yet many times when someone claims that he was speaking in tongues, all that other people hear are just sounds that no one really knows what is being said.

Yet as I have read more about the life of saint Anthony I have noticed that he himself spoke in tongues, the difference is that his listeners actually understood what he was saying.

I am currently reading a book called Saint Anthony The Wonder Worker of Padua

In it is says in chapter 12 " Anthony The Father Of mystic Theology"



" While in Italy he preached in Italian; yet all the knowledge he possessed of that mellifluous tongue he got from his brief intercourse with the six six illiterate lay-brothers at the hospice in the solitude of Monte Paolo. While in France he preached in French, though he had never studied the language."

"Saint Anthony of Padua one of the chosen disciples and companions of Saint Francis, once preached in the Consistory before the Pope and his Cardinals; in which Consistory there were men of diverse nations- namely, Greeks, Latins, Slavs, and English and men speaking other diverse tongues. Fired by the Holy Ghost, so efficaciously, so devoutly, so subtly, so sweet, so clearly, and so plainly did Anthony set forth the word of God, that all they which were present at the Consistory, of whatever diverse tongues they were, clearly understood all his words distinctly, even as he had spoken in the languages of each man amongst them. And they were struck with amaze; and it seemed that the ancient miracle of the Apostles had been renewed, when at the time of the Pentecost they spoke by the virtue of the Holy Ghost in every tongue. And they said one to another, with admiration and awe: Z:' Is not he who preaches come out of Spain? And how do we hear in in his discourse every man of us the speech of his own land?' "


This seems to differ from others claiming to speak in tongues. Others have spoken in phrases that others do not understand, while when Saint Anthony did this, others clearly understood what he was saying.



End of first post.



--------------------------



Second post



Yes, this beautiful story is also included in the Fioretti, the Little Flowers of St Francis.

At another time, St Anthony preached to and was understood by the fishes, in a miracle that converted the whole town of Rimini.

He is one of my favorite saints.



End of second post.



--------------------------



Then the person that started the thread posted these two links.

Speaking in Tongues - A supernatural gift of the Holy Spirit
The Gift of Tongues - Speaking in ones native language while being understood by those of various languages.
www.miraclesofthesaints.com

The book 'Little flowers of Saint Francis'
www.ewtn.com




Hi Mike,

The way I understand it is that when someone is speaking in tongues, there is another who is interpreting what is being said and it is used for the building up and edifying the Church. When we are praying in our prayer language, the Holy Spirit is praying with our spirit to the Heavenly Father because "we do not know how to pray as we ought."
--hide--




Yes.
26 In the same way, the Spirit too comes to the aid of our weakness; for we do not know how to pray as we ought; but the Spirit itself intercedes with inexpressible groanings. 27 And the one who searches hearts knows what is the intention of the Spirit, because it intercedes for the holy ones according to God's will. from Romans 8:26 and 27

Jan 18th 2013 new

There seems to be a discrepancy in our Bibles Marian, to the point of having two different meanings.

Quote from your Bible;
Romans 8:26 "... for we do not know how to pray as we ought ..."

Quote from the Douay-Rheims Bible
Romans 8:26 "... For we know not what we should pray for as we ought ..."

Jan 19th 2013 new

(Quote) Mike-41230 said: There seems to be a discrepancy in our Bibles Marian, to the point of having two different meanings...
(Quote) Mike-41230 said:

There seems to be a discrepancy in our Bibles Marian, to the point of having two different meanings.

Quote from your Bible;
Romans 8:26 "... for we do not know how to pray as we ought ..."

Quote from the Douay-Rheims Bible
Romans 8:26 "... For we know not what we should pray for as we ought ..."

--hide--


I don't see that it points to a very big differnce in meaning.
What is your point Mike?

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