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This room is for the discussion of current events,cultural issues and politics especially in relation to Catholic values.

Saint Thomas More was martyred during the Protestant Reformation for standing firm in the Faith and not recognizing the King of England as the Supreme Head of the Church.
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01/25/2013 new

(Quote) Elizabeth-462557 said: It is a disaster and men and women will die because women won't be able to keep ...
(Quote) Elizabeth-462557 said:

It is a disaster and men and women will die because women won't be able to keep up. There are no real GI Janes unless you inject them with steroids and testosterone. The PT test is scaled down for women because they can't perform physically equal to men. On the battlefield, time means lives. This equality stuff has gone way over the edge of lunacy. Women can contribute in ways that will not put people at risk.

I am hoping we have gone so far to the left that everyone will get a stomach full, but I'm afraid good men and women will have to die before this stupidity will be seen for what it is...beyond ridiculous. Men and women ARE DIFFERENT...not better or worse, just different.

- Elizabeth

--hide--

Keep in mind that the PT test is supposed to measure the physical fitness of the individual, not the ability to perform any particular task. That being the case the standard does need to be different for the same reason that Olympic events hold men and women's events separately.

01/26/2013 new

(Quote) Elizabeth-462557 said: It is a disaster and men and women will die because women won't be able to keep ...
(Quote) Elizabeth-462557 said:

It is a disaster and men and women will die because women won't be able to keep up. There are no real GI Janes unless you inject them with steroids and testosterone. The PT test is scaled down for women because they can't perform physically equal to men. On the battlefield, time means lives. This equality stuff has gone way over the edge of lunacy. Women can contribute in ways that will not put people at risk.

I am hoping we have gone so far to the left that everyone will get a stomach full, but I'm afraid good men and women will have to die before this stupidity will be seen for what it is...beyond ridiculous. Men and women ARE DIFFERENT...not better or worse, just different.

- Elizabeth

--hide--



Couldn't have said it better myself, Elizabeth, and I am really, really smart!! wink

01/26/2013 new

Here is a link to an female Marine officer's (and combat veteran's) take on women in combat: www.mca-marines.org.


This stuff should be common sense. As she said, "The bottom line is that the enemy doesn’t discriminate, rounds will not slow down, and combat loads don’t get any lighter...."

She's right about combat, and right that women were not built for careers in the infantry. Short deployments, even repeated ones, are demanding enough - what about twenty years of training, field exercises, road marches, etc? Not every man can last twenty years under that kind of strain, and the ones that do are almost always physically worn out at the end, well beyond their years.

01/26/2013 new

(Quote) Bernadette-605528 said: Here is a link to an female Marine officer's (and combat veteran's) take on women in...
(Quote) Bernadette-605528 said:

Here is a link to an female Marine officer's (and combat veteran's) take on women in combat: www.mca-marines.org.


This stuff should be common sense. As she said, "The bottom line is that the enemy doesn’t discriminate, rounds will not slow down, and combat loads don’t get any lighter...."

She's right about combat, and right that women were not built for careers in the infantry. Short deployments, even repeated ones, are demanding enough - what about twenty years of training, field exercises, road marches, etc? Not every man can last twenty years under that kind of strain, and the ones that do are almost always physically worn out at the end, well beyond their years.

--hide--

Your link isn't working, so I can't comment on the article.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying there isn't a difference in the physical demands of an Infantryman and a mechanic. I'm just pointing out that the purpose of the PT test is not to declare somebody is physically capable of doing any particular job, it's supposed to be about general physical fitness (how good a job it does of that is a different question). Consequently the fact that the standards are different between men and women isn't a valid example of a problem with women in combat.

01/27/2013 new

Oops, added a symbol. Here's the link again - www.mca-marines.org

01/27/2013 new

(Quote) Bernadette-605528 said: Oops, added a symbol. Here's the link again - www.mca-marines.org.
(Quote) Bernadette-605528 said:

Oops, added a symbol. Here's the link again - www.mca-marines.org

--hide--

A good article, she brings up a lot of good points.

01/27/2013 new

(Quote) Bernadette-605528 said: Here is a link to an female Marine officer's (and combat veteran's) take on women in...
(Quote) Bernadette-605528 said:

Here is a link to an female Marine officer's (and combat veteran's) take on women in combat: www.mca-marines.org.


This stuff should be common sense. As she said, "The bottom line is that the enemy doesn’t discriminate, rounds will not slow down, and combat loads don’t get any lighter...."

She's right about combat, and right that women were not built for careers in the infantry. Short deployments, even repeated ones, are demanding enough - what about twenty years of training, field exercises, road marches, etc? Not every man can last twenty years under that kind of strain, and the ones that do are almost always physically worn out at the end, well beyond their years.

--hide--


With all that they know now about the wounds these Marines and soldiers have suffered (and are suffering) in our recent wars (the loss of one or more limbs, the loss of sight, post traumatic stress disorder, concussive brain damage, et cetera), I think that for anyone to volunteer for a combat arms position is akin to volunteering to get into a horrific car accident without wearing seatbelts. (One has NO IDEA how he or she will end up.)

While I understand a young man's interest in certain challenges this offers, and his "knowledge" that he will never be the one killed or maimed (because after all, these things only happen to The Other Guy), it is beyond me that "adults" in the military and in the government can be having this conversation. As I said earlier, I don't think this is driven by ideology as much as it is driven by economics; i.e., a collapsing empire fighting to maintain itself.

01/27/2013 new

(Quote) William-607613 said: With all that they know now about the wounds these Marines and soldiers have suffered (...
(Quote) William-607613 said:



With all that they know now about the wounds these Marines and soldiers have suffered (and are suffering) in our recent wars (the loss of one or more limbs, the loss of sight, post traumatic stress disorder, concussive brain damage, et cetera), I think that for anyone to volunteer for a combat arms position is akin to volunteering to get into a horrific car accident without wearing seatbelts. (One has NO IDEA how he or she will end up.)

While I understand a young man's interest in certain challenges this offers, and his "knowledge" that he will never be the one killed or maimed (because after all, these things only happen to The Other Guy), it is beyond me that "adults" in the military and in the government can be having this conversation. As I said earlier, I don't think this is driven by ideology as much as it is driven by economics; i.e., a collapsing empire fighting to maintain itself.

--hide--

I have to disagree with you here; it's ideology, not economics.

The military is not having problems getting people specifically into combat arms, consequently opening those fields up for women is not gaining an economic advantage.

I can't quote numbers here, but I don't think too many people walk into the recruiter's office and say, "yeah, I'd like to join the Army/Navy/Marines/Air Force, I couldn't care less what job I have, just sign me up for something." People ship to boot camp with a specific job already lined up.

There are jobs where they have problems keeping manning levels up. For instance, the Navy has trouble recruiting and retaining people to operate nuclear reactors. But I don't think the Infantry has nearly the same problem.

01/27/2013 new

Agreed - the reason for opening jobs to women is not economics. In fact, the military is struggling with a huge increase in retention caused at least in part by the recession and is having to tighten standards or just raise them arbitrarily in order to force more people out, just to stay afloat.

01/27/2013 new

(Quote) Cheryl-409772 said: Well, the problem is that they will water down the requirements to meet a quota. If ther...
(Quote) Cheryl-409772 said:



Well, the problem is that they will water down the requirements to meet a quota. If there is no quota and they don't water it down, then more power to the one or two women in the whole country that can meet those requirements.

--hide--
When I was still working and riding the bus, we had a lady driver who stood over six feet and had shoulders to rival a Redskins linebacker. There may be some women who can handle combat conditions, but they would be a rare exception. Another thing to consider is that the combat soldier of today may be a thing of the past in another generation or two. We seem to be relying more on Special Ops. rather than sheer numbers. Out of necessity we are incrementally relying on drones and other robotics technology.

For us Catholics who are well aware of our Holy Father's viewpoint on war, it is frustrating to see it's technological evolution rather than it's eventual elimination.

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