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This room is for general discussion that doesn't specifically fit into one of the other CatholicMatch rooms. Topics should not be overly serious as this is to be more of a "cafe setting."

Saint Peter's Square was created so that more people could be in the presence of the Pope and was named after Saint Peter, one of Jesus's apostles.
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Mar 2nd 2013 new

Josephine,

Hi....yes, I noticed I had indicated John instead of Richard but, at that point it was too late. The message was the point, and I didn't think drawing additional attention to the obvious would be constructive at that point.

I am glad the message was helpful to you as well, as I have had quite a journey of my own (for different reasons), and all I can say is there were some valuable lessons to be learned and I am thankful to have been given the 'sight to see'. I hope that the benefit of those lessons can be shared when appropriate.


Peace be with your spirit. rosary theheart Praying Have a great day!

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Mar 2nd 2013 new

(Quote) Patsy-932553 said: John, Your sadness is understandable and angst valid. Do not be disheartened. It is Lent. A time ...
(Quote) Patsy-932553 said:

John, Your sadness is understandable and angst valid. Do not be disheartened. It is Lent. A time of trials, as it was with Jesus. There are may events happening around us all to which we can only respond to by falling to our knees and praying, as we really have no control of any outcome. Give it to God. If eveything has been done that can be, be still. The answer will reveal itself. There may be something hidden in this event to strengthen or show you, or provide someone else hope.

I recently heard from someone about a chapel in Chicago, that was located within a hospital, and was in jeopardy of a similar fate. I hope you will find encoragement in their story. Ironically, it is The National Shrine of St. Frances Xavier Cabrini in Chicago. Please keep us updated and realize, those who have let you down are only human they need your prayers now more than ever.

Remembering each of you and your fellow parishoners in my prayers. Peace be with your spirit.

--hide--



Hi Patsy ... I second Josephine's sentiments ... Your comments are much appreciated and I can tell they are of good spirit ... Yes, the St Frances Xavier Cabrini Shrine has been mentioned to our people and it is an outlet we need to explore for possible support and advice ... What a perfect connection it could be for us ....

Thank you again and hope things are good for you in Ga ... God bless ..

Joh ... oops, I mean Richard!

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Mar 2nd 2013 new

(Quote) Josephine-586127 said: I echo what Sean said. It is foolish to believe that God wants his houses closed. And are yo...
(Quote) Josephine-586127 said:

I echo what Sean said. It is foolish to believe that God wants his houses closed. And are you suggesting that I am turning my back on God and sinning because I am voicing my deep disgust over the SHAMEFULL way the Bishops are treating us regarding church closures. You know nothing about the way they treat people- I DO!!! And you know nothing about me. So I suggest you worry about youself and YOUR sins and not about me. YOU DON"T KNOW ME. HOW DARE YOU SUGGEST I AM SINNING.
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Josephine,

I am completely at peace with my post after checking it again...what I said so as to NOT be misquoted by you is that FREE WILL does not give us license to say no to God....what that entails I did NOT say. I do believe for me personally that unless our Church leaders are doing something IMMORAL, I will be obedient to their leadership as God is telling us to do thus I will not be committing a sin...obedience is hard sometimes but in this case others have also stated that they probably have their reasons including having to make up finances for the sex scandals. I will continue to worry about my sins as I will continue to worry about the sins I see affecting the rest of my Church as I am called to do as a Catholic Christian. While this is a shame as I have repeatedly said, I do NOT believe it gives anyone license to cause scandal which was my point. As far as whether or not I or any of my family members have been mistreated by those in Church leadership....I think most of us have at one time or another and I can definitely say that I've been there as has my mother and a few other people I know but again that is neither here nor there to the discussion but just an interesting point since you accuse me of not knowing you...nor do you know me, and again either way knowing you or not knowing you had nothing to do with the discussion or the point I was making. Idon't have a problem with you voicing your "deep disgust" by the way but my issue was with causing more scandal to the church as someone else had suggested. If you even read my post, you will see that I also said this was sad, but I like many of the posts that mentioned the church is the people and the sacraments not the building first and foremost. Again, free will does not give us license to go against our church authorities...indeed it does just the opposite as I believe we are to be obedient unless it is immoral. If I did not believe this, I most assuredly wouldn't have bothered to get my annullment.

LOCKED
Mar 2nd 2013 new

(Quote) Sean-851370 said: I highly doubt God wants churches to be closed. A bishop isn't God and should be chall...
(Quote) Sean-851370 said:



I highly doubt God wants churches to be closed. A bishop isn't God and should be challenged when he isn't obeying Him. The sorry state of the Church shows that Church leaders themselves are the ones who have not obeyed.

--hide--
Sean one more thing...as long as this is not immoral who are you to say that the bishop is ont obeying God. Others have said that this is a very good Bishop who is trying to help the financial situation that the diocese is having. Again it is very sad.....but I'm afraid were headed for a lot more closings in the future to with the lack of church attendance and moral decay and part of that decay is the refusal of people to be OBEDIENT.

LOCKED
Mar 2nd 2013 new

Josephine,

I also want to add that I'm sorry if you've suffered any hurt. I guess where I'm at with this is that the church has suffered so much scandal as it is and that has caused a lot of the loss of attendance because Catholics don't understand why they are there...not for the church leaders or the church or the congregation, but for the sacrament...communion...it breaks my heart to see so many people leave for reasons like these. So many people forgetting humility is necessary for all the other graces God gives us. In my family, I am the only remaining Catholic child for instance....there are a lot of reason for that too that I'm not getting into on this thread but bottom line is if we didn't have the loss of attendance none of these churches would be closing. Unfortunately, we just loss 6 families this year in our tiny town church and who knows what will happen there. If it does get closed, I'll be paying these horrible high gas prices to drive 30 miles to church, and I can barely maintain that driving 30 miles to work every day.

LOCKED
Mar 2nd 2013 new

Hi Richard,

I hope your parish will reach out to St Frances Xavier Cabrini Shrine to see if they have any suggestions in your plight. I see that you have kept your humor and that is really important. It appears that there are many people praying for your church. I felt compelled to respond as the coincidence is strikingly similar. Now there is one more prayer being offered up in hopes of a positive outcome.


God bless theheart rosary theheart

LOCKED
Mar 2nd 2013 new
(Quote) Cheryl-409772 said: Josephine, I am completely at peace with my post after checking it again...what I said so ...
(Quote) Cheryl-409772 said:




Josephine,

I am completely at peace with my post after checking it again...what I said so as to NOT be misquoted by you is that FREE WILL does not give us license to say no to God....what that entails I did NOT say. I do believe for me personally that unless our Church leaders are doing something IMMORAL, I will be obedient to their leadership as God is telling us to do thus I will not be committing a sin...obedience is hard sometimes but in this case others have also stated that they probably have their reasons including having to make up finances for the sex scandals. I will continue to worry about my sins as I will continue to worry about the sins I see affecting the rest of my Church as I am called to do as a Catholic Christian. While this is a shame as I have repeatedly said, I do NOT believe it gives anyone license to cause scandal which was my point. As far as whether or not I or any of my family members have been mistreated by those in Church leadership....I think most of us have at one time or another and I can definitely say that I've been there as has my mother and a few other people I know but again that is neither here nor there to the discussion but just an interesting point since you accuse me of not knowing you...nor do you know me, and again either way knowing you or not knowing you had nothing to do with the discussion or the point I was making. Idon't have a problem with you voicing your "deep disgust" by the way but my issue was with causing more scandal to the church as someone else had suggested. If you even read my post, you will see that I also said this was sad, but I like many of the posts that mentioned the church is the people and the sacraments not the building first and foremost. Again, free will does not give us license to go against our church authorities...indeed it does just the opposite as I believe we are to be obedient unless it is immoral. If I did not believe this, I most assuredly wouldn't have bothered to get my annullment.

--hide--


The religious leaders of the church are causing the scandals, not the laity who are speaking out. I see how out of touch you are so I will not argue further.

I will instead pray for you.
LOCKED
Mar 2nd 2013 new

(Quote) Josephine-586127 said: The religious leaders of the church are causing the scandals, not the laity who are speaking...
(Quote) Josephine-586127 said:

The religious leaders of the church are causing the scandals, not the laity who are speaking out. I see how out of touch you are so I will not argue further.

I will instead pray for you.
--hide--



I think that the scandal of the laymen is that they haven't done enough to push back against the moral collapse of the Church. Here in town we had people who thought the closings were wrong but refused to do something to stop them. The Church needs the laity to step in and say to the priests, religious, etc. "stop what you're doing!" Laymen paid for the construction of churches, schools, convents and rectories. People need to use their minds instead of blindly relying on what a priest or religious tells them.

LOCKED
Mar 2nd 2013 new

(Quote) Josephine-586127 said: The religious leaders of the church are causing the scandals, not the laity who are speaking...
(Quote) Josephine-586127 said:

The religious leaders of the church are causing the scandals, not the laity who are speaking out. I see how out of touch you are so I will not argue further.

I will instead pray for you.
--hide--



I think that the scandal of the laymen is that they haven't done enough to push back against the moral collapse of the Church. Here in town we had people who thought the closings were wrong but refused to do something to stop them. The Church needs the laity to step in and say to the priests, religious, etc. "stop what you're doing!" Laymen paid for the construction of churches, schools, convents and rectories. People need to use their minds instead of blindly relying on what a priest or religious tells them.

LOCKED
Mar 3rd 2013 new

Amazing how sometimes the day's Gospel hits very close to home ... Here is a passage from today:

And Jesus continued with this story: A man had a fig tree growing in his vine­yard and he came looking for fruit on it, but found none. Then he said to the gar­de­n­er: ‘Look here, for three years now I have been looking for figs on this tree and I have found none. Cut it down, why should it use up the ground?’ The gardener replied: ‘Leave it one more year, so that I may dig around it and add some ferti­lizer; and perhaps it will bear fruit from now on. But if it doesn't, you can cut it down’.
Luke 13:1-9

For me, this passage seems more than a coincidence today. When the Archdiocese told us our church was closing, that's what we asked for - one year. Give us a year to see if we can meet all the targets (attendance, whatever); if we can't meet the stated goals in one year, then OK, you can close us down. So far, our request has been ignored. Guess Jesus' ending to this parable doesn't apply in the modern day. That's odd, because I always marvelled at how His parables stood the test of time and still fit in in the 20th and 21st centuries .

Guess times really do change ....





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