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This room is for discussion related to learning about the faith (Catechetics), defense of the Faith (Apologetics), the Liturgy and canon law, motivated by a desire to grow closer to Christ or to bring someone else closer.

Saint Augustine of Hippo is considered on of the greatest Christian thinkers of all time and the Doctor of the Church.
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Mar 7th 2013 new

(Quote) Noemi-900477 said: *passionate kissing, that is. Kissing for the mere pleasure of kissing ---> passionate kissing...
(Quote) Noemi-900477 said:

*passionate kissing, that is. Kissing for the mere pleasure of kissing ---> passionate kissing ---> higher temptation, actions that lead to the marital act, etc. ---> not okay.

Someone, anyone...is my understanding correct that non-passionate kissing is okay? (please tell me I am correct! haha)

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The Priest said that a kiss on the cheek is okay.He quoted a Pope.Is there a higher Authority than that?

Mar 7th 2013 new

(Quote) Jim-13836 said: I never heard any of this before Bernard posted that link and I listened to that homily...
(Quote) Jim-13836 said:


I never heard any of this before Bernard posted that link and I listened to that homily. I took notes as well. It makes me wonder what else I have missed having been taught after Vatican II. And for the record grandma only got kissed on the cheek.


Thanks for Bernard for posting the link and to everyone else here for the clarification.

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You are welcome.

Mar 7th 2013 new

(Quote) Sheila-371804 said: Thank you Emily, I'm grateful you understood my point. A MORTAL SIN for kissing or holding h...
(Quote) Sheila-371804 said:

Thank you Emily, I'm grateful you understood my point. A MORTAL SIN for kissing or holding hands with your significant other. It is incomprehensible to me, and contrary to what I was taught by our Parish Priest.

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The fact you don't understand it doesn't make it wrong. Have you listened to the sermons and made an effort to understand them rather than looking for ways to ridicule the message? If you think you can discredit them, why not do so with facts rather than appeals to emotion?

What exactly did you parish priest say? And what is the basis in moral theology supporting his opinion?

Mar 7th 2013 new

(Quote) Sheila-371804 said: Greeting's Bernard, I have heard countless theories, and viewpoints from my fellow Ca...
(Quote) Sheila-371804 said:

Greeting's Bernard,

I have heard countless theories, and viewpoints from my fellow Catholic Match peers, on the interpretation of the Bible's content, and while some have enlightened me immeasurably, other appeared to be unduly, harsh, punitive, and excessively judgemental ! That is precisely why when I have a question regarding the Bible I seek the advice of my own ordained Parish Catholic Priest, not some over zealous pious CM member attempting to impose his/her opinion on me !

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I am guessing you did not actually listen to the Audio link?I did not give my opinion.It was the Priest who was Quoting a Pope who gave his opinion on the matter in an Audio taped sermon.Seems that you are taking it personally Sheila.I am just sharing the link.I would be suspect of your Priests opinion over that of a Pope.Don't you think? Anyway,thanks for the hate mail. boggled

Mar 7th 2013 new

(Quote) Sheila-371804 said: Thank you Emily, I'm grateful you understood my point. A MORTAL SIN for kissing or holding h...
(Quote) Sheila-371804 said:

Thank you Emily, I'm grateful you understood my point. A MORTAL SIN for kissing or holding hands with your significant other. It is incomprehensible to me, and contrary to what I was taught by our Parish Priest.

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He never said that it was a Mortal Sin for holding hands BTW.

He said that kissing for the sake of arousing the passions.That which belongs to the married State only.He also stated that it is a Mortal Sin if the person was aware of it.So everyone reading this thread is now aware.

Mar 7th 2013 new

I think the more a person develops his/her conscience through conversion- the more in tune to sin and responsible conduct a person becomes. The relationship with God takes precedence over all actions- "be holy as i am holy" is a more concrete reality. And I'm not judging anyone...

Mar 7th 2013 new

(Quote) Monica-730858 said: I totally understand what you are saying because I felt the same way and was literally shocked ...
(Quote) Monica-730858 said:

I totally understand what you are saying because I felt the same way and was literally shocked when I realized that kissing could be a mortal sin. I, being a convert thought that it would be impossible to find someone who would not engage in premarital sex. Then I started listening to these homilies recently and thought, "you have to be kidding me...kissing is off the table too?" But after A LOT of time spent thinking about it and praying about it and listening to similar homilies and finding out how Catholics used to view things (change isn't always a good thing) it started to make sense. If I'm really honest I can't think of a relationship I've ever had with a guy where he didn't expect passionate kissing to lead to more. I suppose that could be possible, I just haven't encountered it. And, if you think honestly about it what is the point of passionate kissing? Can anyone really kiss someone this way and not have their passions stirred up? I mean, isn't that the point? I would really encourage you to try to find a way to listen to him if you can. I can't imagine anyone hearing a few of his homilies and not agreeing with him. He's speaking the truth and his only motive is trying to get souls to heaven.
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I read of an incident where a priest was explaining this teaching to a group of Catholic teenagers and one young man stood up and explained that he could see nothing wrong with French-kissing his girlfriend, as his passions were simply not stirred up when he did so. "Well," the priest said, "then you're doing it wrong."

...
I think what's missing in the modern courtship is the idea that a man and a woman have to first be friends before they can be spouses. Pope Benedict XVI had recently said as much. Unfortunately, marriage in the post-sexual revolution stage of history has left an awful lot of carnage in its wake, and those who would ignore the teaching on this subject really have no success models to show us. I think the best advice I got from a priest (and yes, an FSSP priest) on the subject that a man and woman should behave as brother and sister during a courtship.

Mar 7th 2013 new

(Quote) Monica-730858 said: I totally understand what you are saying because I felt the same way and was literally shocked ...
(Quote) Monica-730858 said:

I totally understand what you are saying because I felt the same way and was literally shocked when I realized that kissing could be a mortal sin. I, being a convert thought that it would be impossible to find someone who would not engage in premarital sex. Then I started listening to these homilies recently and thought, "you have to be kidding me...kissing is off the table too?" But after A LOT of time spent thinking about it and praying about it and listening to similar homilies and finding out how Catholics used to view things (change isn't always a good thing) it started to make sense. If I'm really honest I can't think of a relationship I've ever had with a guy where he didn't expect passionate kissing to lead to more. I suppose that could be possible, I just haven't encountered it. And, if you think honestly about it what is the point of passionate kissing? Can anyone really kiss someone this way and not have their passions stirred up? I mean, isn't that the point? I would really encourage you to try to find a way to listen to him if you can. I can't imagine anyone hearing a few of his homilies and not agreeing with him. He's speaking the truth and his only motive is trying to get souls to heaven.
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An excellent post, Monica!

It completely understandable that you were shocked when you first hear the message: it's certainly not one most people have heard before, and it is diametrically opposed to the culture most of us have grown up in and been formed by. It's certainly not an easy thing to accept -- which is a pretty good indication it is correct ("Enter ye in at the narrow gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way that leadeth to destruction, and many there are who go in thereat. How narrow is the gate, and strait is the way that leadeth to life: and few there are that find it!" Matt. 7:13-14).

The path you took is a perfect example of how must approach these situations if we are to develop spiritually; if we rely on our emotional reactions, as many do, we are allowing ourselves to be lead astray by those who wish nothing more than to claim our souls as trophies, as if they provide any consolation in their own eternal damnation.

Mar 7th 2013 new

(Quote) William-607613 said: I think what's missing in the modern courtship is the idea that a man and a woman have to f...
(Quote) William-607613 said:

I think what's missing in the modern courtship is the idea that a man and a woman have to first be friends before they can be spouses. Pope Benedict XVI had recently said as much. Unfortunately, marriage in the post-sexual revolution stage of history has left an awful lot of carnage in its wake, and those who would ignore the teaching on this subject really have no success models to show us. I think the best advice I got from a priest (and yes, an FSSP priest) on the subject that a man and woman should behave as brother and sister during a courtship.

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The Priest in the Audio link is an FSSP Priest.A great one too!

Mar 7th 2013 new

(Quote) William-675153 said: I think the more a person develops his/her conscience through conversion- the more in tune to s...
(Quote) William-675153 said:

I think the more a person develops his/her conscience through conversion- the more in tune to sin and responsible conduct a person becomes. The relationship with God takes precedence over all actions- "be holy as i am holy" is a more concrete reality. And I'm not judging anyone...

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Precisely!

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