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A place to learn, mingle, and share

Discussion related to living as a Catholic in the single state of life. As long as a topic is being discussed from the perspective of a single Catholic then it will be on-topic.

Tobias and Sarah's story is from the Book of Tobit, and his journey is guided by Saint Raphael.
Learn More: Tobias & Sarah as led by Saint Raphael

Mar 25th 2013 new

(Quote) Edward-926612 said: That's true. When I was working at Walgreens I was fresh out of college. Despite a c...
(Quote) Edward-926612 said:



That's true. When I was working at Walgreens I was fresh out of college. Despite a college degree --- I was working with a salary just above minimum wage. I tried my best at growing in the company but they were downsizing. Needless to say, I could barely support myself at the time let alone anyone else so I didn't date much until recently (that and I believe any dating should be with the intention of "is this person someone that I would potentially like to get to know in order to possibly join in the sacrament of holy matrimony with?) God works in mysterious ways and we should just look at the holy family as our example. St. Joseph being there for our Lord as a carpenter providing for the family be it financially or even fleeing persecution.

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Exactly. Back in Biblical days if the man could not support the woman financially there is no way her father would trust him to take care of her. It should be the same way today. Even though we women tend to be a bit more independent and educated today than in Biblical days or even 50 years ago, we still want a leader. Most men get intimidated by women who are educated, opinionated, intelligent, etc. etc. But the truth is that it is such a turn on when a man takes a risk with one of us. Afterall, doesn't he want his future children to have a strong, educated, and intelligent mother? I would certainly hope so. For society's sake and the sake of his children in case something was to happen to him.

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Mar 25th 2013 new
(Quote) Tiffiany-902101 said: Well cultural differences aside, in American culture, living at home past a...
(Quote) Tiffiany-902101 said:





Well cultural differences aside, in American culture, living at home past a certain age, especially if you are a man, is a bit ridiculous from a woman's perspective. Now if a guy is living at home and financially contributing to help out his parents then that is a different story. Not as attractive as if he had his own place, but either way it's rare to find a guy who's financially independent, has an education, a decent career going on, and seems like he is "headed somewhere" in life. So many guys focus on finding a woman to date that if they took just half that time to focus on personal goals and achievements they may find that they'd be more attractive candidates.

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Gen 2:24 "For this reason a man shall leave his father and his mother, and be joined to his wife; and they shall become one flesh."

One could argue, we shouldn't be leaving our parents until married. Just food for thought. Also, just cause it is apart of American Culture doesn't necessarily make it right.

Now back to you original topic wave We are out there. I think you would find a broad range of ages meeting what you expect. I'd say anywhere from 23 to 35 would be the normal per say. As you said there would be circumstances that may prevent it based on culture and other issues. I know for me personally, I moved out of my parents multiple times. Of course, I was in the military so didn't have much choice in the matter laughing I officially moved out when I was 29. Now granted, I was super ambitious when I got out of the military to get my degree done and I'm working on my Master's now. I'm even considering working on a 2nd bachelor's in Theology. I think there are a lot more of us than you think but a lot of us may be too busy to even date. I'm pretty busy but I make the time to date.

Another issue that I see with people once they settle down and get married is a lot of the ambitions to accomplish certain things get put to the side because you have a family to take care of. So some men may see it easier to get a lot of the accomplishments done before settling down.
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Mar 25th 2013 new

(Quote) Andrew-560653 said: Gen 2:24 "For this reason a man shall leave his father and his mother, and be joined to hi...
(Quote) Andrew-560653 said:

Gen 2:24 "For this reason a man shall leave his father and his mother, and be joined to his wife; and they shall become one flesh."

One could argue, we shouldn't be leaving our parents until married. Just food for thought. Also, just cause it is apart of American Culture doesn't necessarily make it right.

Now back to you original topic We are out there. I think you would find a broad range of ages meeting what you expect. I'd say anywhere from 23 to 35 would be the normal per say. As you said there would be circumstances that may prevent it based on culture and other issues. I know for me personally, I moved out of my parents multiple times. Of course, I was in the military so didn't have much choice in the matter I officially moved out when I was 29. Now granted, I was super ambitious when I got out of the military to get my degree done and I'm working on my Master's now. I'm even considering working on a 2nd bachelor's in Theology. I think there are a lot more of us than you think but a lot of us may be too busy to even date. I'm pretty busy but I make the time to date.

Another issue that I see with people once they settle down and get married is a lot of the ambitions to accomplish certain things get put to the side because you have a family to take care of. So some men may see it easier to get a lot of the accomplishments done before settling down.
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Right Andrew. I knew at some point someone was going to use that verse. However, that verse was written when people were married at the age of 15. Today most people aren't getting married until they are in their 20's and 30's. If a man is 30+ and living with his parents it is embarassing, unless there are certain circumstances that just explain this (e.g. one of his parents is ill and he's helping to take care of them or he's gone through bankruptcy). However, in either case he really shouldn't be focusing on trying to find a wife, especially in the latter scenario.

Well, I don't doubt that these men are out there. I just doubt that they spend a lot of time pursuing women. And the wrong types spend too much time pursuing women when they should be working on themselves. Such as furthering their education, getting a job, moving up in their job, etc. Honestly my age range is probably set for someone 27-45, particularly because women tend to mature faster than men. But, there are always exceptions.

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Mar 25th 2013 new

(Quote) Tiffiany-902101 said: Exactly. Back in Biblical days if the man could not support the woman financially there is no ...
(Quote) Tiffiany-902101 said:

Exactly. Back in Biblical days if the man could not support the woman financially there is no way her father would trust him to take care of her. It should be the same way today. Even though we women tend to be a bit more independent and educated today than in Biblical days or even 50 years ago, we still want a leader. Most men get intimidated by women who are educated, opinionated, intelligent, etc. etc. But the truth is that it is such a turn on when a man takes a risk with one of us. Afterall, doesn't he want his future children to have a strong, educated, and intelligent mother? I would certainly hope so. For society's sake and the sake of his children in case something was to happen to him.

--hide--


That's very true! A smart lady is very much the backbone of the family. She will be a great mother for the children and a fantastic wife. Intelligence is a very important quality and I think many people take it for granted.

I think in the end it comes to a crisis within society. At times I would like to meet someone (in a public place of coarse), buy them lunch or dinner, if things go well and depending on time go out and do an activity but most importantly of all end the day in a prayer. I just simply don't see why many women drag their feet when it comes to do this and will resort in either ignoring the topic or speak in generalities.

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Mar 25th 2013 new

(Quote) Edward-926612 said: That's very true! A smart lady is very much the backbone of the family. She will be ...
(Quote) Edward-926612 said:



That's very true! A smart lady is very much the backbone of the family. She will be a great mother for the children and a fantastic wife. Intelligence is a very important quality and I think many people take it for granted.

I think in the end it comes to a crisis within society. At times I would like to meet someone (in a public place of coarse), buy them lunch or dinner, if things go well and depending on time go out and do an activity but most importantly of all end the day in a prayer. I just simply don't see why many women drag their feet when it comes to do this and will resort in either ignoring the topic or speak in generalities.

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Well, I cannot speak for all women and certainly cannot speak from experience since I don't pursue women. Haha! What I can say is that I never drag my feet. I don't have time for it. It's typically the guy dragging his feet in my case. Hence, why I listed that I want a man who "knows what he wants."

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Mar 25th 2013 new

(Quote) Tiffiany-902101 said: Well, I cannot speak for all women and certainly cannot speak from experience since I don'...
(Quote) Tiffiany-902101 said:

Well, I cannot speak for all women and certainly cannot speak from experience since I don't pursue women. Haha! What I can say is that I never drag my feet. I don't have time for it. It's typically the guy dragging his feet in my case. Hence, why I listed that I want a man who "knows what he wants."

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LOL! Good one. I just don't see how anyone could drag their feet with you. You love children, are well educated, have a great smile and have the Catholic faith (I find that many times converts make the best Catholics because of their search for the truth). These are the most basic elements anyone on here should be looking for.

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Mar 25th 2013 new
Well thank you Edward! ;) I don't understand it either. But, I've heard I'm pretty intimidating. Maybe that's it? Or I have this concept that you should "treat others as you want to be treated." IDK. They taught it to me in Catholic kindergarten but apparently some folks must've been sick that day. Lol. For whatever reason, God just hasn't put someone who can tolerate me into my life yet. And by tolerate I mean is strong enough to be my man. :)
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Mar 25th 2013 new

Well, this thread explains the unexplained.

Crazy thing is: if you're not raised in the Church, and even perhaps if you are, you hear from all sectors that men just aren't good enough. Oh, sure, Home Improvement was just fine as a sitcom in which the dad is a goofball and his wife is right 95% of the time, but then this becomes a standard trope. Commercials, too. Magazines, too. Movies, too. Yeah.

While it's certainly understandable for women to show concern for a man's ability to provide as a man, one could posit the reverse as well. Thus I ask in turn: where are the women who can cook? Women who are discerning and educated enough to be entrusted with an intelligent man's offspring and to homeschool them properly on matters literary, mathematical, theological, historical, artistic, and scientific? Where are the women who have kept themselves chaste? Who have sought to build character and lifeskills rather than acquiring more stuff?

As a man who can make pot roast, turkey, couscous, pizza, bread, and sushi from scratch -- not to mention ice cream, cheese, and rootbeer -- I'd somewhat prefer a woman who can outcook me and who will take the time to look at what is healthy, affordable, and (preferably) organic.

I certainly don't want my children to be subjected to public schooling if it can be avoided. They lie about the church, essentially avoid discussion of morals, and altogether just don't teach well. The New International Version of the Bible is translated at the eighth-grade reading level because that is the highest complexity that doesn't give the average high-school grad a mild headache; the average college graduate reads *comfortably* at the tenth-grade reading level and struggles above that. Since I read the original languages, I will tell you the Bible is certainly above that, and we suffer for lack of quality education.

This shows the failure of public schooling, a failure that I blame primarily on the teacher-to-student ratio (also: teaching to the test). I've had some excellent teachers, let me tell you, but split attention means lower quality. If a woman can teach well, cook well, and has learned arts such as sewing to help save money, that's awesome.

My point is that provision is a team effort with the husband providing raw materials at the risk of exposing himself to outside dangers (especially true in pre-industrial times) while the wife refines the raw materials, including children that are to someday become intelligent, adult Catholics. It's a team effort, and today's society has thrown things into chaos and, although there was no "golden age", neither sex today tends to shine at their traditional roles on average.

Although I fit all three of those qualities you mention, I would suggest another: financial restraint. Ambition is fine and good, and so is having a steady job, but if you don't know how to save money and how to plan for children, retirement, etc., then it really doesn't matter how much you make. Rap stars and football players both have their share of stories in which men with no financial sense suddenly get pretty hefty paychecks. The results, Tiffiany, are seldom good for those without financial sense to invest in low-risk assets.

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Mar 25th 2013 new

Gary, If you want to start your own thread asking where the certain type of woman you are seeking is, feel free. As far as women who can cook, clean, etc. you can add that to my list of qualities. I'm pretty much a jack of all trades. It's what typically happens when you have to become an adult at 14 and raise your two younger siblings. However, I will not be 100% a housewife and homeschool my children. I didn't work countless hours in school and invest in my education to have it be for nothing. As far as a man who is financially stable, I'm not talking about a millionaire/billionaire type nor rapstars, football players, or celebrities. At the core of the problem is that people who cannot make money, do not make money, or squander what they have have a lack of discipline, self-control, and Godliness. Like I said, if you want to start your own "Wanted Ad" feel free but don't rain on my parade. And as far as men using excuses of how society and the media represents them to justify their lack of ambition, education, work ethic, etc--spare me. For years women were not allowed to vote, hold certain jobs, make as much as men, allowed to own land, etc. etc. Did we gripe about it? Sure. But we sure  didn't let is define us or use it as an excuse to maintain the status quo. If a man wants to be a man, be a leader, and step up to the plate let him do so and not let his circumstances nor society squander that. Otherwise it sounds like a cop-out to me.

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Mar 25th 2013 new

The basic fact of life is that you have only so much land, and land can sustain only so many hungry mouths. If a man and his wife have three sons, that's five. OK. They marry, but all stay at home. That's eight. But when married people do what they do, that could potentially produce 3-4 more mouths each year. Exponential reproduction, which was pretty important early on to compensate for war, famine, and disease, could easily overwhelm the patriarch's land. Thus, the wise thing is to send away sons when they marry.

Within the context of Abraham's people, all sons but the firstborn essentially followed the pattern of leaving and cleaving. The firstborn, however, stays in his father's house even after marrying and dutifully remains in order to be there when his father or mother must be buried. Without cars, that's kinda what has to happen. Besides: the firstborn is inheriting everything, so of course he lives in his father's house. It's the lesser sons, like Ishmael, that are sent off with gifts instead of inheriting a portion of the estate.

Unfortunately, there is no frontier land to simply be claimed today. Just knowing how to build a shack and farm is no longer sufficient to move out. Heck, even in Jesus' days it wasn't enough. Families often, contrary to Genesis 2, would stay together simply because the newlyweds couldn't afford a place. We are not called to be reckless or irresponsible, but neither are we called to do as the world does and believe our provisions come simply from our paychecks. Marrying and having children is the daring and the faithful thing to do today.

Any assumption that a poor man who is godly cannot provide -- you know what, never mind. Better the little the righteous have, is all I'm saying.

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