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This room is for the discussion of current events,cultural issues and politics especially in relation to Catholic values.

Saint Thomas More was martyred during the Protestant Reformation for standing firm in the Faith and not recognizing the King of England as the Supreme Head of the Church.
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Apr 6th 2013 new

(Quote) John-221057 said: "think your issue iis that we don't buy into false science like "global war...
(Quote) John-221057 said:

"think your issue iis that we don't buy into false science like "global warming", which has been understood now to be false, and has been since renamed to "Climate Change". It's a moving target meant to confuse people into looking at platforms that are not as important as things like prolife and profamily issues "

You've just proved my point.

Time for a quick lesson on basic science:

- Carbon dioxide in the atmosphere traps heat

- More carbon dioxide = more heat trapped in the atmosphere

- Result = unnatural levels of heat, and thus "global warming" or "climate change"

- some sources of carbon dioxide going into the atmosphere: automobiles, factories, coal plants

See, I know my science and I'm not going to believe a bunch of pseudoscience spouted by oil lobbyists. Real science is actually very simple, but what those who try to distort it do so by making it seem more complext than it is.

--hide--




When one states a premise that is valid, the conclusion has to be logical as well. There can't be glaring holes of missing premises for one to call it a "conclusion" that is logical. Liberals thrive on making arguments like this, just to confuse those who don't have the facts and realize, "Well that doesn't make sense, but I guess he ought to know."

Carbon dioxide traps 'heat', but why don't you tell everyone how much carbon dioxide it would take to raise a temperature to any measurable degree? That premise is conveniently missing, along with the improbability of that ever happening. OK, but, I'll mention it here:
Greenhouse gases consist of only 3% of the atmosphere with 97% of these gases being made up of CO2, CH4, Ozone and N2O*. (*CO2 constitutes about 0.037% of the atmosphere. )

Where is the sun, and the clouds in all these "global warming" assertions? Answer: no where.
The sun plays the biggest part in any climate warming, incidentally. These radiation changes are cyclical and changing all the time. (See: ice age.)

CO2 levels move up and down AFTER the temperature has done so, and thus are the RESULT OF, NOT THE CAUSE of warming. Geological field work in recent sediments confirms this causal relationship. There is solid evidence that, as temperatures move up and down naturally and cyclically through solar radiation, orbital and galactic influences, the warming surface layers of the earth's oceans expel more CO2 as a result.

You also forgot to mention that despite the HUGE surge in carbon dioxide level SOURCES (not the overall levels) emitted from unnatural sources, including homes/apartments/ condos (which, by the way, emit 2 to 3 times the amount of carbon dioxide that any automobile), yet global temperatures fell for four decades after 1940.

We've been sold a bag of goods that CO2 is dangerous to the environment, when in fact, plants require CO2 for food to survive. Plants, in turn, give off oxygen. I guess, maybe we all could hold our breath, stop wearing clothing that is made in factors, live in tents (or at least not in buildings with gas or electric heating), walk to work, and turn off our computers --- just as start.

Apr 6th 2013 new

(Quote) Lynea-297530 said: When one states a premise that is valid, the conclusion has to be logical as well...
(Quote) Lynea-297530 said:





When one states a premise that is valid, the conclusion has to be logical as well. There can't be glaring holes of missing premises for one to call it a "conclusion" that is logical. Liberals thrive on making arguments like this, just to confuse those who don't have the facts and realize, "Well that doesn't make sense, but I guess he ought to know."

Carbon dioxide traps 'heat', but why don't you tell everyone how much carbon dioxide it would take to raise a temperature to any measurable degree? That premise is conveniently missing, along with the improbability of that ever happening. OK, but, I'll mention it here:
Greenhouse gases consist of only 3% of the atmosphere with 97% of these gases being made up of CO2, CH4, Ozone and N2O*. (*CO2 constitutes about 0.037% of the atmosphere. )

Where is the sun, and the clouds in all these "global warming" assertions? Answer: no where.
The sun plays the biggest part in any climate warming, incidentally. These radiation changes are cyclical and changing all the time. (See: ice age.)

CO2 levels move up and down AFTER the temperature has done so, and thus are the RESULT OF, NOT THE CAUSE of warming. Geological field work in recent sediments confirms this causal relationship. There is solid evidence that, as temperatures move up and down naturally and cyclically through solar radiation, orbital and galactic influences, the warming surface layers of the earth's oceans expel more CO2 as a result.

You also forgot to mention that despite the HUGE surge in carbon dioxide level SOURCES (not the overall levels) emitted from unnatural sources, including homes/apartments/ condos (which, by the way, emit 2 to 3 times the amount of carbon dioxide that any automobile), yet global temperatures fell for four decades after 1940.

We've been sold a bag of goods that CO2 is dangerous to the environment, when in fact, plants require CO2 for food to survive. Plants, in turn, give off oxygen. I guess, maybe we all could hold our breath, stop wearing clothing that is made in factors, live in tents (or at least not in buildings with gas or electric heating), walk to work, and turn off our computers --- just as start.

--hide--

The increase in CO2 has never been shown to be the cause of warming temperatures. There was only a correlation by people with a political agenda (like the lie with the hockey stick graph that has since been proven as fraud). These "scientists" never mention the natural cause of the rise in CO2 as the predominating cause, by far, of the rise, and they also fail to bring up that there is no proven connection between the increase of CO2 and warming temperatures. It's just an odd reaching-beyond-science-hoping-the-average-person-won't-know-the-difference/ PR approach.

Apr 6th 2013 new

CO2 does hold heat, but the increase over the past 100 years to the temperature has been only 0.07℃ --- but no scientist can objectively conclude that it is definitely due to the increase CO2, and even then, whether it is due to natural of unnatural causes. There is only suppositions.

CO2 can not hold so much that there is a ever continuing level of increase with no threshold. That is absolutely false, but liberals would like everyone who doesn't understand this science to believe this.

Regarding the significance of the levels of CO2 increase:
Heat bouncing back into the higher atmosphere (space) as a different wave length to the heat coming back in, but not even all these wave lengths are being absorbed by CO2, as it can only absorb a small portion fo the heat coming back out. In other words, there is a limit to how much heat CO2 can keep in, and even if the atmosphere was 100% CO2 (which means we'd all be dead anyway, and is scientifically impossible to occur), the increase of temperature would soon plateau.

Apr 6th 2013 new

(Quote) John-221057 said: "think your issue iis that we don't buy into false science like "global war...
(Quote) John-221057 said:

"think your issue iis that we don't buy into false science like "global warming", which has been understood now to be false, and has been since renamed to "Climate Change". It's a moving target meant to confuse people into looking at platforms that are not as important as things like prolife and profamily issues "

You've just proved my point.

Time for a quick lesson on basic science:

- Carbon dioxide in the atmosphere traps heat

- More carbon dioxide = more heat trapped in the atmosphere

- Result = unnatural levels of heat, and thus "global warming" or "climate change"

- some sources of carbon dioxide going into the atmosphere: automobiles, factories, coal plants

See, I know my science and I'm not going to believe a bunch of pseudoscience spouted by oil lobbyists. Real science is actually very simple, but what those who try to distort it do so by making it seem more complext than it is.

--hide--

If you know science so well, please explain why the 1930's were warmer than today. And more interesting, as best as science can determine, earth temperatures in the 1300's were higher than today.

Was that because Mark Twain's character in a "Connecticut Yankee" actually existed and did create all the industry and automobiles described in that tale and that caused the warmer temperatures.

Of course, how then do you explain the end of the last age, according to your "science" it had to be all those Cavemen" trying to keep warm by burinng eveything in sight?

Even more interesting, why are so called "climate change" scientists so perplexed by the fact that there has actually been a fairly dramatic (in scientific terms) average temperature drop in the last 5 years?

The real scientific fact is that temperatures have been rising in fits and starts since the end of the last ice age and will continue to do so until the next ice age begins when the temperatures, in fits and starts, will go into long term decline.

Apr 6th 2013 new

You know what? Yes, there are problems in Canada. Things are not perfect. They are not perfect in the US either. I hear that from my American
friends and relatives all the time.

I could just as easily take one horrible situation that happened in the US, blow it out of proportion and declare that the way things are done in the US are so horrible that who would want to live there. The Steubenville tragedy is just one example. Someone could go on and on about how young teenaged Americans have no respect for themselves and each other and who would want to raise children in the US because of that. But it’s
not fair to do so.

The sad reality is that Steubenville could have happened anywhere in the western world – just substitute football for hockey, baseball, cricket, soccer or some other sport, unsupervised teenagers experimenting with alcohol, perhaps not knowing its effects, no one stopping offensive behavior,
no one helping someone who was clearly unconscious, no one calling for the police when they witnessed things in person or online, and so on. God help us all regardless of where we live.

Likewise, it is unfair to take a situation of one patient's story with Canadian health care, and declare that the whole thing is so atrocious that who would want to live there.

In a democracy, the people control the government, so the government is not an external entity that controls the people. Individuals may not have the means or resources to obtain things that they require (like heart surgery or cancer treatment), so sometimes collective action is needed to secure individual well-being. Do it through charity, do it through government, regardless, that is not socialism. That is compassion.

No one is forcing Americans to adopt Canadian health care. So-called Obamacare has very little to do with how things run in Canada. I’ve said my peace. There’s a hockey game on that’s way more interesting than what’s happening in the forums. Ice Skating

Apr 6th 2013 new

(Quote) John-221057 said: ... but there are many instances of people dying because they can't afford he...
(Quote) John-221057 said:

... but there are many instances of people dying because they can't afford health care. That is not exactly what I call a conscience. There has never been any incidents of this happening in Canada or in any of the other industrial countries. ...

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If you have a valid point here, then you should have no trouble quantifying the problems with actual numbers and evidence instead of just making unsupported assertions.

As for your claim "There has never been any incidents of this happening in Canada or in any of the other industrial countries" (emphasis added), are you really naive enough to think that there does not exist even a single instance of a somebody in a non-U.S. industrialized country dying while they sat on a waiting list who couldn't have been saved if they had had the money to fly to the U.S. and get treatment in a more expeditious manner?

You seem to put a lot of weight on appearance and labels. Simply calling something "taking care of people" doesn't accomplish anything. Pretending that not having enough equipment or supplies to meet demand somehow doesn't count as people dying for lack of money doesn't change the underlying reality.

There are pros and cons to all systems. Frankly, I don't think anybody on the planet can really claim to have solved the health care problem. Both the U.S. and socialist models lead to inefficiencies and bankruptcies.

Apr 6th 2013 new
(Quote) Cheryl-409772 said: I heard on EWTN that during times of persecution of our faith that the key to changing it was through the cult...
(Quote) Cheryl-409772 said:

I heard on EWTN that during times of persecution of our faith that the key to changing it was through the culture not politics....makes a lot of sense. He gave the example of shakespeare who did not run for office or start a political party during the Elizabethan age when Catholics were being killed but instead, he wrote plays. If you think about it, this makes a lot of sense. Who owns the culture now except the unreligious liberals? And their values have been spreading everywhere since they started "owning" it.


YOur thoughts?

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I think this article ties in nicely with the original purpose of your thread. It suggests the way to change the world is through (Catholic) culture not politics.

www.catholicvote.org
Apr 7th 2013 new

(Quote) Mary-486033 said: We have provided much documentation in ...
(Quote) Mary-486033 said: We have provided much documentation in previous threads about the grave dangers of government-controlled socialized medicine.

Shona Holmes, a Canadian citizen, tells the story of her life-threatening condition, and the failures of Canada's health care system. The treatment Shona received in the U.S. saved her life, but President Obama is making our healthcare system more like Canada's. www.youtube.com

Dangers of Socialized Medicine - This video is an excerpt of the testimony of Richard Baker to the Health Care Solutions Committee on July 23, 2009. Mr. Baker offers examples of problems he has personally witnessed with the Canadian single payer health care system. www.youtube.com

Filmmaker Stuart Browning shows the callousness of "single-payer", government-run health care systems as practiced in Canada. www.youtube.com

Socialized Medicine Nightmare in Britain - USA Beware www.youtube.com
--hide--



therealstory.ca


That woman was a liar and after she was called out on it went into hiding.


You're very quick to believe pieces of scum like the Koch brothers.

Apr 7th 2013 new
(Quote) John-221057 said: (Quote) Mary-486033 said: We have provided muc...
(Quote) John-221057 said:

Quote:
Mary-486033 said: We have provided much documentation in previous threads about the grave dangers of government-controlled socialized medicine.

Shona Holmes, a Canadian citizen, tells the story of her life-threatening condition, and the failures of Canada's health care system. The treatment Shona received in the U.S. saved her life, but President Obama is making our healthcare system more like Canada's. www.youtube.com

Dangers of Socialized Medicine - This video is an excerpt of the testimony of Richard Baker to the Health Care Solutions Committee on July 23, 2009. Mr. Baker offers examples of problems he has personally witnessed with the Canadian single payer health care system. www.youtube.com

Filmmaker Stuart Browning shows the callousness of "single-payer", government-run health care systems as practiced in Canada. www.youtube.com

Socialized Medicine Nightmare in Britain - USA Beware www.youtube.com




therealstory.ca


That woman was a liar and after she was called out on it went into hiding.


You're very quick to believe pieces of scum like the Koch brothers.

--hide--
You stated: "...there are many instances of people dying because they can't afford health care. There has never been any incidents of this happening in Canada or in any of the other industrial countries."

First of all your statement is completely false! People are most certainly dying due to government-controlled socialized medicine systems. One woman...Shona Holmes is a moot point in the big picture. Secondly, Mayo Clinic stated should would have lost her vision. I see you ignored all the other cases. Here's more:

*Up to 1,200 patients died unnecessarily because of appalling care www.dailymail.co.uk

*The majority of NHS hospitals in England are being given financial rewards for placing terminally-ill patients on a controversial pathway to death www.telegraph.co.uk

*Thousands Die Prematurely on U.K. 'Death Pathway' www.ncregister.com

*60,000 patients put on death pathway without being told but minister still says controversial end-of-life plan is 'fantastic' www.dailymail.co.uk

*How 600 die of thirst in care homes: Damning report exposes the rising number of elderly killed by neglect www.dailymail.co.uk

*Doctors Haunting Testimony: UK Babies Put on Euthanasia Pathway www.lifenews.com
Apr 7th 2013 new
(Quote) Dan-28682 said: The etymology of the word psychology is the greek word "psykhe" which means "breath, spirit, soul&q...
(Quote) Dan-28682 said:

The etymology of the word psychology is the greek word "psykhe" which means "breath, spirit, soul" + "logia" which means "study of" so psychology is the study of the spirit or the soul. Sounds a lot like religion does and in fact a good argument can be made that psychology is really a secular religion...a religion that is often at odds with our Christian beliefs on fundamental topics such as the anthropology of man. For reference you could try Paul Vitz's book, "Psychology as Religion". One major difference, however, is that while we are forbidden from teaching our Christian faith in public schools, almost everyone ends up taking psychology classes...in fact they are even taught in high school now. Is it any wonder that we are losing our Christian culture?

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On a side note, check out Conrad Baars and Anna Terruwe's writings and also Dr. Baars' daughter, Suzanne, who is regularly on EWTN. There is good Catholic psychology and it is a blessing--understanding the Thomistic view of our intellect and emotions.
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