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This room is for discussion related to learning about the faith (Catechetics), defense of the Faith (Apologetics), the Liturgy and canon law, motivated by a desire to grow closer to Christ or to bring someone else closer.

Saint Augustine of Hippo is considered on of the greatest Christian thinkers of all time and the Doctor of the Church.
Learn More: Saint Augustine

May 15th 2013 new

(Quote) Peter-793888 said: Another thought, and I'm sure the gentlemen that said this to me isn't the o...
(Quote) Peter-793888 said:


Another thought, and I'm sure the gentlemen that said this to me isn't the only one who thinks like this. I jokingly said to him "Keep out of trouble" and his response was a very serious "I don't need to keep out of trouble, I'm Catholic!" I did a double take and asked him what he meant. His answer was, "I can do whatever I want to, that's the beautiful thing of being Catholic. I'll just go to confession on Friday and everything is taken care of. It's a beautiful thing."

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I had to explain the "sin of persumption" to a Hindu girl who had catholic friends like that. They'd really given her the wrong end of the stick on the whole Confession thing. Never mind the fact they coudl die between fornication and confession, then where would they be?

I dislike the notion that people are so ignorant in this day and age. My parents were from the sexual revolution generation, and as such, have a lot non-catholic ideas. I was taught those ideas. The same ideas were prevelant throughout my entire Catholic schooling. Even heard them from priests. The whole fornication was bad back then because of risk of pregnancy and STDs but now we don't have to worry. An old man could only be comfortable if he had a virgin daughter to sell into marriage. So fornication is okay now. Contraception is respsonible parenting. What does some old pope know? These ideas never sat well with me. Then I found the Internet. I understood why such ideas are wrong.

Anyone who has access to this site, has access to the internet. There's nothing stopping them from learning the Truth. They owe it to themselves. This isn't some backwater village in Africa or some oppressed communist Chinese region. There's no excuse for the modern, Western Catholic to not and understand their faith. If people have time to troll through profiles on a singles' site they have time to Google the catechism. Seesh, its not theoretical physics.

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May 15th 2013 new

Premarital sex is not ok and it is untrue to say that "women here go along with it to avoid being ignored." Not true. One simply cannot make blanket statements like this and have ther be any truth to them. Interesting topic though..

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May 15th 2013 new

(Quote) Frank-797076 said: ... If you believe in the Real Presence, and Papal Infallibilty, andThe Virgin Birth and so many ...
(Quote) Frank-797076 said:

... If you believe in the Real Presence, and Papal Infallibilty, andThe Virgin Birth and so many other Catholic things, why would you think that God is misleading His Church through the Holy Spirit leading it to pronounce that pre-marital sex is wrong? ...

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Yes, and conversely, if a person fails to believe that all that the Church teaches is true, why

would he believe that anything that the Church teaches is true? From where does such a person

get his bearings on what is true, other than from the Church to whom Jesus has given

authority to teach in His name ?

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May 15th 2013 new

Premarital sex is sin. It is not Okay.

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May 15th 2013 new

Here's an article I want everyone to read -- it helps us understand hoe NOT to teach about sex. I'm posting it here but want to post it other places too so more people see it.


www.patheos.com

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May 15th 2013 new

Once when many of my girls were still teens, I was in a meeting with our priest. He was railing on and on about how provacatively the young girls in Mass were dressing and how he was going to institute a dress code and have A Knight at the door to turn them away it they didnt meet it. He ended his rant with "after all priests are men, too and I don't need to be tempted". I stood up and said "Father, are you blaming these adolescents, who are experimenting with their newfound adult bodies, for YOUR lust?. for your sin? Where do you want these girls to be on Sunday morning, standing outside the church or inside where you and the rest of us can gently and with tact explain how dressing this way can be bad for their souls, for their salvation?. Your attitude may be Catholic, but it is not Christ-like."
The attitude of that priest is often found in the responses to these kind of questions. Of course pre-marital sex is wrong. But the harsh critcism of those who answered the question "wrong" is not Christ-like. He gathered the sinners to him with love and explained how, what and why God wants us to obey his commandments and the reason is always the same; it is for our own good!
Pre-marital sex and the answer to that question hurts no one else on this site except the person who engages in it. I would like to see the responses to that question reflect concern and love for those who misguidedly believe otherwise, instead of anger and recrimination. Pre-marital sex is wrong because it hurts us, it leads to other sin and it leaves us open to self hate, disease, low self esteem and depression. I would like to speak to those honest people who answered "no" to open a dialogue to the practical harm it does, without judging their beliefs. To the men I have spoken to on here who answered "yes" and then talked to me about having sex right away, well you cant change honesty

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May 15th 2013 new

(Quote) Joan-461057 said: Once when many of my girls were still teens, I was in a meeting with our priest. He was railing on...
(Quote) Joan-461057 said:

Once when many of my girls were still teens, I was in a meeting with our priest. He was railing on and on about how provacatively the young girls in Mass were dressing and how he was going to institute a dress code and have A Knight at the door to turn them away it they didnt meet it. He ended his rant with "after all priests are men, too and I don't need to be tempted". I stood up and said "Father, are you blaming these adolescents, who are experimenting with their newfound adult bodies, for YOUR lust?. for your sin? Where do you want these girls to be on Sunday morning, standing outside the church or inside where you and the rest of us can gently and with tact explain how dressing this way can be bad for their souls, for their salvation?. Your attitude may be Catholic, but it is not Christ-like."
The attitude of that priest is often found in the responses to these kind of questions. Of course pre-marital sex is wrong. But the harsh critcism of those who answered the question "wrong" is not Christ-like. He gathered the sinners to him with love and explained how, what and why God wants us to obey his commandments and the reason is always the same; it is for our own good!
Pre-marital sex and the answer to that question hurts no one else on this site except the person who engages in it. I would like to see the responses to that question reflect concern and love for those who misguidedly believe otherwise, instead of anger and recrimination. Pre-marital sex is wrong because it hurts us, it leads to other sin and it leaves us open to self hate, disease, low self esteem and depression. I would like to speak to those honest people who answered "no" to open a dialogue to the practical harm it does, without judging their beliefs. To the men I have spoken to on here who answered "yes" and then talked to me about having sex right away, well you cant change honesty

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Actually, I agree with your priest Joan. I don't know about turning someone away from the church completely, but they should certainly not be allowed to sit in the body of the church or receive Holy Communion! Immodest dress is extremely leading to impurity [for others] [in thought especially] and can be a very serious sin for those who dress this way with those intentions. Essentially, a woman dressed immodestly is a "public sinner"- not for any percieved looseness in her life, but simply and basically based on the sin she commits in her dress. There are many 'virgins' I know, who dress in a very provocative manner- having sex-outside-marriage isn't the only way to sin against chastity.

Please note that Christ did not allow Mary Magdeline around him while she was still a practicing..ahem, woman of the night.. but after her conversion. Also, we, as women, really cannot say how our behaviour and dress affects men- it is better to err on the side of caution. Sometimes a man- a good man!- is allowed to be tempted in this regard, but it would certainly be better if our actions were not the cause of it.

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May 15th 2013 new

Hi Frank

Your ever hear men saying how wives should be submissive to their husbands? It is in the Bible. Women should come back with, "Men should love their wives..." Saying that wives should be submissive is fine, but it is not the whole story. When anyone forgets to teach the whole story, or lives their life on part of the story they are wrong.

So it is with sex. Judism and Catholicism acknowledge the intensely sexual nature of men and women and actually encourage people to have sex. It is a very old tradition. Now it is true that men and women are encouraged to wait until marriage, but there is, again, more to the story.

Our roots come from a time when women were thought of as property. If a man needed a wife he could go buy one. Courtship, dating and engagement were very different than they are today. In past times a woman could not be seen with a man who was not her husband. So, one might ask, how do you go out on a date? Even today, in parts of the world and in various cultures in the United States, the process of getting married would view things like CM as absolutely wrong. I have seen posts, on THIS website, where a Catholic priest condemned what we do on CM as wrong. His reasoning was that it lead to too much serious conversation between men and woman which leads to lust, or the desire for sex.

So fine, it is ok to say not to have sex before marriage but we should tell all of the story. Not just part of it. So what is the rest of the story?

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May 15th 2013 new

(Quote) Felicity-929402 said: Actually, I agree with your priest Joan. I don't know about turning someone away ...
(Quote) Felicity-929402 said:

Actually, I agree with your priest Joan. I don't know about turning someone away from the church completely, but they should certainly not be allowed to sit in the body of the church or receive Holy Communion! Immodest dress is extremely leading to impurity [for others] [in thought especially] and can be a very serious sin for those who dress this way with those intentions. Essentially, a woman dressed immodestly is a "public sinner"- not for any percieved looseness in her life, but simply and basically based on the sin she commits in her dress. There are many 'virgins' I know, who dress in a very provocative manner- having sex-outside-marriage isn't the only way to sin against chastity.

Please note that Christ did not allow Mary Magdeline around him while she was still a practicing..ahem, woman of the night.. but after her conversion. Also, we, as women, really cannot say how our behaviour and dress affects men- it is better to err on the side of caution. Sometimes a man- a good man!- is allowed to be tempted in this regard, but it would certainly be better if our actions were not the cause of it.

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There are many who think that a man should be able to control his own thoughts and not sin based on how a woman dresses. There are several bible verses that speak about how one can cause another to sin, or cause scandal and how that itself is a sin. As a man this issue hits very close to home in an over sexualized world. It is almost impossible to go a day without some image or person that elicits or sparks impure thoughts. While it is my responsibility to not dwell or give in to those thoughts most of the time I'm not the one causing them to be brought to mind. Responsibility also lies on those who dress in ways to ilicit those thoughts in either sex, especially if that is their intention to do such. I'm sure many women do it ignorantly, and this is something we as Catholics need to educate people on so they are not ignorant of how important dress is to chastity/modesty/sins against the 6th and 9th commandments.

I know many people personally who call themselves devout catholics of both sexes who believe whole heartedly that people can dress however they want and the responsibility for sin is only on the person who has impure thoughts. Our Lady of Fatima even told the children that there would be fashion that would gravely offend her Son. These lies from the father of lies need to be combated and the truth needs to be promoted and embraced. Many rosary need to be prayed for this an all the sins of the world.

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May 15th 2013 new

(Quote) Rachel-731570 said: Here's an article I want everyone to read -- it helps us understand hoe NOT to teach about s...
(Quote) Rachel-731570 said:

Here's an article I want everyone to read -- it helps us understand hoe NOT to teach about sex. I'm posting it here but want to post it other places too so more people see it.


www.patheos.com

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Rachel, I was intrigued by this website. Thanks for sharing.

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