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This room is for discussion related to learning about the faith (Catechetics), defense of the Faith (Apologetics), the Liturgy and canon law, motivated by a desire to grow closer to Christ or to bring someone else closer.

Saint Augustine of Hippo is considered on of the greatest Christian thinkers of all time and the Doctor of the Church.
Learn More: Saint Augustine

May 16th 2013 new
Lesil-- Your answers are to reflect your current beliefs, not your past beliefs or failings. Our Catholic faith is not one that is to be believed 'ala carte' or 'cafeteria style' -- we don't get to pick and choose which parts to keep and which to toss out. So, to those people who want to 'equally yoked' to another full Catholic, answering 'yes' to all 7/7 is important and meaningful. We all sin -- no one can claim not to -- but we should all be striving to not sin -- we shouldn't feel that some sins are 'less sinful' than others and therefore ok to partake in. No one here is helping anyone by ok-ing sex outside of marriage -- your mortal soul is in danger! It would be wrong to condone the sin of premarital sex -- and it is not compassionate to say nothing when good people like you mistakenly think that sex outside marriage is more a personal choice than the sin it is. And pointing out that this is a sin IS compassionate -- because others care about your soul and where it will end up. You say you would rather be single than married to a man who wants you because you believe in all the Church's teachings -- would you rather be married to a man who does not care about your soul and gaining heaven?
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May 16th 2013 new
(quote) Lesil-840134 said: I responded "No" because I do not want to mislead my potential partner, if he is out here. I am just no longer a virgin. Period. As much as I can, I would like to wait. But I couldn't completely say, I would not in the future, I am no saint.
Lesil, the question is not whether you failed and sinned in the past. The question is not whether you are a virgin. The question is whether you assent to what the Church teaches to be true with authority.

Do you assent that the marital embrace is only to be enjoyed licitly in marriage? Do you assent that fornication, that is, the use of the marital embrace outside of marital bonds, is a grave sin? Do you assent that adultery, that is, the use of the marital embrace together with one who is bound by marriage to another or when one's self is so bound to another, is a grave sin? etc.

If you assent to the Church's teaching, then you are deceiving potential suitors by your "no" answer as to whether you accept the Church's teaching regarding pre-marital relations.
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May 16th 2013 new
Naomi, I so love your posts!
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May 16th 2013 new
Yep. Adam supported Eve and got his butt kicked.

So?

God supported man. No doubt was not pleased with man's sin but what really happened? Tell the whole story. Our have you forgot about the Sacrifice of Jesus? If God cannot forget about me, I certainly cannot forget about my wife. It says somewhere, not in the newspaper, that husbands should love their wives as Christ loves the Church.

You all need to forget about sex. Seek the love that is supposed to exist between man and woman. Plan your dating to discover and test that love. Sex should never even come up between two Catholics that are dating, in conversation, or otherwise.
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May 16th 2013 new
Lesil, God love you. You and all of us are children of God. He is a God of Divine Mercy. Do you want to avoid sins of impurity? If you do, then that is what the question is about? If you want to avoid fornication and are willing to give it your best, that is what is important. You can do it and your dating partner can do it with a positive and willing attitude.

God bless and keep you!
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May 16th 2013 new
Hi Lesil,
Let me begin by saying that I could hear the truth and anxiety in your post and I understand. But, the question is not "Are you a virgin? Are you perfect? Will you always be chaste? IF that were the question I feel safe to say most of us would fall short in that department. I am certainly no virgin nor was I before I got married. Which I now TOTALLY regret. We are all fallen and just are answering in the content on how I /we look at pre-marital sex NOW. No one is judging the other for not being a virgin or having had sex in the past when we were unwed. I am Jesus' Mary Magdelene. I was not chaste before my marriage or after I was divorced. I regret my past but am now born anew and am TRYING to live out everyday as "God's girl". I am not chaste for fear of STD's. I am chaste because I only want to please Him. I don't want to break God's heart, that's why. So, now Lesil, it does not make us any less of women and I am sorry if you were made to feel that. But I know my fellow Catholics on this site/forum are awesome spirited people and gracious of heart. Of course you were NEVER any less of God's child when you/we were living a life of fornication. That is what the parable of The Prodigal Son is telling us, my sister. The same goes for the Parable of the Woman at the Well and the story of the woman about to be stoned. It's all about MERCY! That is Our Sweet Saviour's message. DIVINE MERCY....sigh...:) :) Go and sin no more! And if you fall....GET UP!!! I know that you do or you wouldn't be on a Catholic website trying to hook up with like minded people. Once again, I am sorry you felt judged. Our Lord just want us Prodigal daughter's to run into His arms and receive all the graces He has for us, if we have repented and have a firm purpose of amendment. Just because you/we have engaged in pre-marital sex does not mean we believe in it. It just means we majorly blew it, need to RUN to confession and go and sin no more. We are here for you.

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May 16th 2013 new
Hi Frank

I really don't think we disagree. The Catholic Church demands that husbands and wives love each other. That love really isn't there on your first date but must be there on your wedding. It goes without saying that sex is left for after marriage.

But the teaching of the Catholic Church places sex in a context of a committed, loving, married relationship between a man and a woman. When dating the sexual status of the man or woman cannot be brought up. At my age I don't expect to date virgins. I don't ask, I do not want to know. I think that anybody that wants to know is probably a pervert and I will not date them. I actually had a woman ask me if I paid for sex. Wonder what she was thinking. Wonder why she brought that up too. Maybe she paid for sex, who knows. Maybe she was broke and needed money. Anyway, don't see her anymore. Certainly did not have sex with her.

People have enough to deal with in dating. They shouldn't worry about sex. Probably everyone on this site has issues. Some are shy, some are recovering from drugs, or booze, or promiscuity. But life is a test for you. You have been given gifts by God. One of those gifts is sex. Another, more important gift is the ability to love. How do you say you love someone, or anyone, when you ask them to identify their feelings on sex, or Holy Orders, or hot fudge sundaes for all I care and then use that knowledge to single them out as part of someone you wouldn't date, or do not approve of?

I think you were joking about a harem. But come on, do you have girls? Remember how they got along with their mothers? Why would you want to have several women in one house? Seems like they would fight all the time.


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May 17th 2013 new
Everytime there is something on the Internet about stuff like this and you see an article on how you're supposed to think about premarital sex and then how ignorant and liberal most people are about it- more than likely most people are gravitated to the article that tells what you Should Not do and they do it anyway. Then they say, "Oh this is how you're supposed to think about this issue." You seriously wish you could smack them on the head and say, " You didn't understand the article at all!" I don't know it's weird.... It's like you say "dont do this or that" and that makes them want to do it even more!
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May 17th 2013 new
Pre-marital sex and contraception are not OK. My own problem with answering YES to both questions is the "rest of the story". The Church's position regarding procreation that is attached to both contraception and pre-marital sex is still not clear to me. Contraception blocks the ability to procreate. So does NFP! Pre-marital sex is just that...pre-marital (or outside of marriage). Procreation is not something that should happen outside of marriage. I have been in discussions with Catholics who believe that post-menopausal sex is against the Church position, as well, because the possibility of pregnancy without Divine intervention is virtually impossible. If what they believe is correct, then why does the Church perform marriages between "old people"? Until I get a solid answer on this, my answer will be NO. That's not a NO because I believe that contraception and pre-marital sex are OK but because the "rules" aren't clear.
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May 17th 2013 new
(quote) Sheila-953093 said: Pre-marital sex and contraception are not OK. My own problem with answering YES to both questions is the "rest of the story". The Church's position regarding procreation that is attached to both contraception and pre-marital sex is still not clear to me. Contraception blocks the ability to procreate. So does NFP! Pre-marital sex is just that...pre-marital (or outside of marriage). Procreation is not something that should happen outside of marriage. I have been in discussions with Catholics who believe that post-menopausal sex is against the Church position, as well, because the possibility of pregnancy without Divine intervention is virtually impossible. If what they believe is correct, then why does the Church perform marriages between "old people"? Until I get a solid answer on this, my answer will be NO. That's not a NO because I believe that contraception and pre-marital sex are OK but because the "rules" aren't clear.
Well, this new format is less than pleasant, I typed out a rather detailed post and it refused it. Here's the shortened version:

God killed Onan cos he spilled his seed.

The punishment for avoiding the responsibiility of fathering your dead brother's kid wasn't death, it was a telling off from your father, then a telling off from the Rabbi, then a social chastisement, then still if in refusal, you were kicked out of the community. This shows us God isn't happy about people contracepting.

Contraception vs. NFP boils down to two things, working with what gives us, and intention.

God built in the woman's reproductive cycles, with fertile and infertile times, there is no sin taking advantage of the infertile times, because the couple is still open to life. Granted, NFP can still be used sinfully, like a defacto "catholic contraception".

There are three people in a marriage, Man, WOman and God. During the sex act man brings sperm, woman brings ovum, God brings soul. Contraception blocks out God completely. And it places a barrier between man and woman. Marriage and sex are meant to be fully open and fully giving and fully receiving, contraception blocks from other the gift of one's fertilty. If one partner is contracepting, they are holding back a part of themselves. That is not the mutal giving of entire self marriage was designed for.

Post menopausal and infertile spouses are moot, as contraception for the sake of contraception has no point.

Scripturally and theologically one can [ignorantly] debate contraception, but the Bible is cut and dry clear on fornication and its rammifications. Fornication is wrong becaue the couple are telling porkies with their bodies, they are engaged in an act meant for marriage, not for single life boredom. Furthermore, marriage at its essence is an entire surrender to the other spouse, and by engaging in the sexual act they are expressing that. For a single couple to fornicate, they are in serious error, as if they were prepared to give to each other fully as is happening in the sex act, they'd get married first.

Plus, the statistics on fornication leading into divorce once married are quite worrying. Want to protect your future marriage, don't fornicate.
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