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This room is for discussion related to learning about the faith (Catechetics), defense of the Faith (Apologetics), the Liturgy and canon law, motivated by a desire to grow closer to Christ or to bring someone else closer.

Saint Augustine of Hippo is considered on of the greatest Christian thinkers of all time and the Doctor of the Church.
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May 30th 2013 new
(quote) Paul-866591 said: In what century and where did this supposed daily mass attendance take place by, "The rural peasants of Christendom... ." ?

Daily Mass attendance by the average person is only a rather recent (within the last 100 years or so) phenomena. And it was rare even during the hay day of the Church in moire recent times before the 60's.
By "Christendom", of course, I mean medieval Europe. Remember that Catholic churches were ubiquitous during those days, with priests readily available. The centuries in question would be the 13th and 14th centuries (minus a major setback during the Great Schism between Rome and Avignon), mainly in France, Germany and Italy, thanks to the work of Ss. Francis, Dominic and Vincent Ferrer. I highly suggest that you read the life of St. Vencent Ferrer. You will find it pretty astounding. Of course, I'm not saying that this daily mass attendance lasted forever (the Renaissance and the Reformation essentially put paid to that practice). But such titanic saints as those mentioned literally moved spiritual mountains for the people of Christendom.
May 30th 2013 new
(quote) Mary-870064 said: I have been running into people who think its okay to miss mass on Sunday, and can't even make it Saturday night ! A lot has to do with there job and such, but you would think you could make the time anyway, or even ask for a few hours to go to mass. We seem to be forgeting it is a mortal sin! I mean if it was not important God would not have made it law, right? He knows the world is so busy and hectic, that we need that day of rest and worship to take time and thank him for all his blessings and just be still. Thats what makes us different from other religions, and is the heart of our faith. Anyone feel the s
I just have to put my two cents in!
For 15 years, I worked 7am-7pm shift that included every other weekend. I truly missed going to Sunday Mass. I recorded the Mass for shut ins with my VCR when that was possible.
I taught 7th grade CCD, was active in the funeral luncheon ministry, was a leader in the Sunday scripture study group, all while missing Mass every other week! After a few years I started going to Mass an alternate day of the week.
The point is, my 'work' required me to care for the sick and fragile members of the Body of Christ. It is in the belief that a nursing ministry requires the sacrifice of missing Sunday Mass. My kids went with their caregiver's family while I was at work.
So... Why we miss is probably more important than when we miss.

May 30th 2013 new
(quote) Jim-873983 said: By "Christendom", of course, I mean medieval Europe. Remember that Catholic churches were ubiquitous during those days, with priests readily available. The centuries in question would be the 13th and 14th centuries (minus a major setback during the Great Schism between Rome and Avignon), mainly in France, Germany and Italy, thanks to the work of Ss. Francis, Dominic and Vincent Ferrer. I highly suggest that you read the life of St. Vencent Ferrer. You will find it pretty astounding. Of course, I'm not saying that this daily mass attendance lasted forever (the Renaissance and the Reformation essentially put paid to that practice). But such titanic saints as those mentioned literally moved spiritual mountains for the people of Christendom.
Daily Mass attendance has NEVER BEEN a predominant feature of the life of the Catholic Laity in any time since the Church began.

One might find instances of it in individual locales because of the presence of a great Saint in that local.

And if you had not noticed, many Saints throughout the ages including our own time have and do accomplish what your last sentence describes. Alas, their influence is always, for the most part even today in the age of instant and global communications, rather local in nature and wanes after they pass on to their Eternal reward. Although there have always been exceptions. In the period you claim saw massive daily Mass attendance, communications were rather limited in nature and even those Saints we look on today as very great Saints had very limited impact outside of their immediate area.
May 30th 2013 new
(quote) Paul-866591 said: Thinking it is alright to miss mass on Sunday has absolutely nothing to do with idolatry.
Agreed. It is impiety, but not idolatry. Loving sleep more than mass is idolatry, however.
May 30th 2013 new
(quote) Paul-866591 said: Daily Mass attendance has NEVER BEEN a predominant feature of the life of the Catholic Laity in any time since the Church began.

One might find instances of it in individual locales because of the presence of a great Saint in that local.

And if you had not noticed, many Saints throughout the ages including our own time have and do accomplish what your last sentence describes. Alas, their influence is always, for the most part even today in the age of instant and global communications, rather local in nature and wanes after they pass on to their Eternal reward. Although there have always been exceptions. In the period you claim saw massive daily Mass attendance, communications were rather limited in nature and even those Saints we look on today as very great Saints had very limited impact outside of their immediate area.
That is a pessimistic and incorrect sentiment. St. Vincent Ferrer literally saved the world by converting the whole of Christendom from its wicked ways in the 14th and 15th centuries. If it were not for him, the Apocalypse would have happened 600 years ago! God Himself verified that through a resurrection of a dead women at his command to verify this claim. Through his thousands upon thousands of miracles, and his widespread travels and preaching using the same gift of tongues given to the Apostles at Pentacost to communicate to every tongue in Europe, he allowed the world to continue. That's hardly an issue of "individual locale".

I invite you (and anyone else interested in him) to listen to a retelling of his incredible life and ministry here:

www.audiosancto.org

You're missing my point anyway. My point is that if those who have had a much more grueling work schedule than us did go to Mass every day, at least for a time and at least in a locale, then we have no excuse to miss Mass on Sunday in the days of instant communication and cars.
May 30th 2013 new
(quote) Gary-936836 said: Agreed. It is impiety, but not idolatry. Loving sleep more than mass is idolatry, however
Can you explain this further I'm not sure I understand?
May 30th 2013 new
Hi Sheila,
I have a family member like that. She drops off her daughter at school then attends 8am Mass (which she is always late for, since her daughter is suppose to be at school @ 8am and is always late) she says she goes to this Mass because there is no one there, it's short, and that way she doesn't get bored. You can't even talk to this person. I asked her when she told me this "Well do you go to the Sat. nite vigil or Sunday mass?" and she replied "No! I go 5 days a week that's enough, I put in my time, my weekends are MY time!!!" Mind you, she is unemployed. So if I told her it was a mortal sin (which I am sure she knows) she would argue with me and get super defensive. I know it's my duty and I know it is one of the spiritual works of mercy "to inform the ignorant" but it won't make a difference. This is someone you can not even disagree with or they will shut you out and not call you for months. So, I have given up. I do know it's a mortal sin and when it has happened to me I know I need to get to confession PRONTO! I am so glad you started this thread. People need to know it's not ok as a Catholic to miss weekly mass. I wish more people would see it as just that. He gives us 168 hours a week. Can we not give Him one?
May 30th 2013 new
And WHO we miss.... theheart rosary angel
May 31st 2013 new
(quote) Jim-873983 said: That is a pessimistic and incorrect sentiment. St. Vincent Ferrer literally saved the world by converting the whole of Christendom from its wicked ways in the 14th and 15th centuries. If it were not for him, the Apocalypse would have happened 600 years ago! God Himself verified that through a resurrection of a dead women at his command to verify this claim. Through his thousands upon thousands of miracles, and his widespread travels and preaching using the same gift of tongues given to the Apostles at Pentacost to communicate to every tongue in Europe, he allowed the world to continue. That's hardly an issue of "individual locale".

I invite you (and anyone else interested in him) to listen to a retelling of his incredible life and ministry here:

http://www.audiosancto.org/sermon/20090301-Saint-Vincent-Ferrer-The-Angel-of-the-Apocalypse.html

You're missing my point anyway. My point is that if those who have had a much more grueling work schedule than us did go to Mass every day, at least for a time and at least in a locale, then we have no excuse to miss Mass on Sunday in the days of instant communication and cars.
Sorry,but St Vincent had and has nothing to do with averting the apocalypse.

The fact that any miracle was performed through his intersession attests to nothing having to do with the end times but only to his special relationship,with God.

Although he was a successful preacher, he traveled only in parts of Western Europe, including Spain (his homeland), France, Switzerland and Northern Italy. He never traveled in the majority of Europe, nor in Englang Ireland or what we now know as the British Isles. He never set foot in Northern Europe, Southern Italy, Germany, Austria, Poland, European Russia, or the Slavic nations.

He had a hand, but not the decisive one, in ending the Great Western Schism. Even if he had done so single handedly, that would hardly qualify as avoiding, in your words, the Apocalypse or allowing the world to continue. That claim is patent nonsense.

And he would be one of the exceptions that proves the rule that most Saints, even today, only affect their immediate locale during their lifetime. St. Francis would be another exception. But those exceptions are few and far between. Most Saints have their biggest impact after they are dead.

It does a severe injustice to the Church and to the cause of evangilization when we Catholics spout exaggerated stories or use unnecessary hyperbole to describe the accomplishments of God's heros we honor as Saints.

Thank you for at least somewhat acknowledging your overblown hyperbole in your original post. Which proves my point that daily Mass attendance by a large numbers of the laity at any point in Church History is uncommon and isolated to single locales for relatively short periods.

Throughout history, sad to say, even the required weekly attendance at mass by the majority of the laity is unusual.

Since your point has no basis in fact, I did not miss it. In fact I addressed the false nature of your statement.

The fact that even a single person with a grueling work schedule can find time to go to Mass wheterh Daily or just in fulfillment of the Sunday obligation is enough to demonstrate that we have no excuse to miss Mass on Sunday except for illness and those instances when one's work schedule truly make it impossible to do so.
May 31st 2013 new
(quote) Joseph-903200 said: Can you explain this further I'm not sure I understand?
Idolatry is giving adoration to anyone or anything other than God Himself.

So just believing that it is alright to miss Mass on Sunday is not idolatry.

What would be idolatry is if you say it is more important to watch Sunday's football game. In that instance you are giving adoration to something, the football game, that belongs to God alone. The idolatry is not the beleiving that one can miss Mass, but the adoration you would be giving to the game.

Just believing that one can miss Mass on Sunday is the sin of not keeping the Lord's Day, a serious act of impiety but not idolatry.
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