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Going to Hell Posts

Sep 14th 2013 new
I have been a catholic match member on and off over the years and find it to be an excellent site. Initially, I just ignored the forums and focused only on the dating part. I then realized I was missing out on quite a bit.

Overwhelmingly, I enjoy the posts that I read - even those I have strong disagreement. I appreciate members taking the time to give their honest and heartfelt feedback on particular topics - with one exception: the you better be a perfect catholic or you are going to hell posts.

I mean - is that really necessary? In all my years of catholic education and attending mass, I don't think I ever heard the fire and brimstone "you better obey catholic doctrine or get ready for an eternity in a lake of fire." For those who feel strongly about obeying catholic doctrine, by all means make your point - but do it a positive way like Pope John Paul or even Christopher West (who I personally am not a huge fan, but at least I have never heard him condemn anyone to hell.)

Now, am I saying the topic of hell isn't important? No - not at all. I do believe it is a place for the worst of mankind' souls such as Hitler, Hussein and Kermit Gosnell (hopefully he repents to save himself). But, is it appropriate for anyone who may have had pre-marital sex? Shouldn't we atleast leave that to God to decide? Also, what about purgatory anyways? We as catholics are suppose to believe in that as a way of purifying us who are not yet ready for heaven.

My suggestion is if someone wants to start a topic on hell - go ahead. Make your posts in this forum if you want. Otherwise, how bout making your points in not such a condemning fashion.

Sep 14th 2013 new
(quote) Patrick-341178 said: with one exception: the you better be a perfect catholic or you are going to hell posts.


I have been an active CM forum participant for 9 years. Perhaps old age is starting to catch up with me, but I don't recall ever having seen such a post -- although I have seen many misrepresented as such.

Perhaps you can provide links to several such posts so we can see exactly what you are referring to before commenting.

Sep 14th 2013 new
(quote) Patrick-341178 said: Now, am I saying the topic of hell isn't important? No - not at all. I do believe it is a place for the worst of mankind' souls such as Hitler, Hussein and Kermit Gosnell (hopefully he repents to save himself). But, is it appropriate for anyone who may have had pre-marital sex? Shouldn't we atleast leave that to God to decide? Also, what about purgatory anyways? We as catholics are suppose to believe in that as a way of purifying us who are not yet ready for heaven.

My suggestion is if someone wants to start a topic on hell - go ahead. Make your posts in this forum if you want. Otherwise, how bout making your points in not such a condemning fashion.

To the point of Hell being reserved for "the worst of mankind's souls":

"Enter ye in at the narrow gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way that leadeth to destruction, and many there are who go in thereat. How narrow is the gate, and strait is the way that leadeth to life: and few there are that find it!" (Matt 7:13-14)

Straight from the Gospel: many go to hell, few go to heaven. Does this sound like hell is reserved only for the worst of the worst? St. Teresa of Avila was given a vision of souls falling to hell like snowflakes. The few worst?

No one here has claimed that anyone who has had pre-marital sex is condemned to hell. As with any other sin, those who repent and confess are forgiven. However, if one dies with unrepented mortal sins on their soul they will be damned. This is a very clear teaching of the Church.

The reason these topics keep coming up is because there are those who refuse to accept the Church's teaching -- which comes straight from Scripture -- that sex outside marriage is a mortal sin. Logically, if one does not believe an act is a sin, they are not likely to repent and confess it.

The point is not to declare people to be condemned, but to help them realize the need to accept grave sin for what it really is, and to repent and confess these sins so that they won't be condemned.

Purgatory is for the purification of souls that are in a state of grace at death that are not completely pure. Souls with unrepented mortal sin at death are not in a state of grace, thus purgatory is not an option.

Sep 14th 2013 new

The gate is narrow. Just because it is not preached does not mean it is not real. Here is one priest who has addressed the topic:

www.youtube.com

Sep 14th 2013 new
(quote) Patrick-341178 said: In all my years of catholic education and attending mass, I don't think I ever heard the fire and brimstone "you better obey catholic doctrine or get ready for an eternity in a lake of fire."
This sounds very much like the Catholic education that I and most people on this site had- a very poor Catholic education. The lack of a balanced Catholic education (including Hell, Purgatory and final judgment) is what is lacking in the "feel-good" Church of today and is contributing to the lack of sense of sin which rather sadly probably results in eternal damnation for many as unsavoury as that is to discuss.

If none of us believe in sin and Hell we are by definition more likely to make choices that are more likely to be of the world rather than of God's Holy Will and commandments.

I find it refreshing when a priest preaches the Truth and sometimes it is personally confronting. I would rather be confronted and challenged and avoid the eternal fire that many believe does not exist rather than be appeased in the spirit of tolerance.


Sep 14th 2013 new
Oh, Jerry, I see it all the time...though not so much now as 7 years ago.
Sep 14th 2013 new
Nicely put.
However, I'm with Patrick: it's not the responsibility of anyone here to judge anyone else.
Teach? Yes.
Lead? Yes.
Inspire? Definitely.
The self-righteous can sit down and mind their own souls. God decides who goes to hell. No one else.
Sep 14th 2013 new
(quote) Jerry-74383 said: To the point of Hell being reserved for "the worst of mankind's souls":

"Enter ye in at the narrow gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way that leadeth to destruction, and many there are who go in thereat. How narrow is the gate, and strait is the way that leadeth to life: and few there are that find it!" (Matt 7:13-14)

Straight from the Gospel: many go to hell, few go to heaven. Does this sound like hell is reserved only for the worst of the worst? St. Teresa of Avila was given a vision of souls falling to hell like snowflakes. The few worst?

No one here has claimed that anyone who has had pre-marital sex is condemned to hell. As with any other sin, those who repent and confess are forgiven. However, if one dies with unrepented mortal sins on their soul they will be damned. This is a very clear teaching of the Church.

The reason these topics keep coming up is because there are those who refuse to accept the Church's teaching -- which comes straight from Scripture -- that sex outside marriage is a mortal sin. Logically, if one does not believe an act is a sin, they are not likely to repent and confess it.

The point is not to declare people to be condemned, but to help them realize the need to accept grave sin for what it really is, and to repent and confess these sins so that they won't be condemned.

Purgatory is for the purification of souls that are in a state of grace at death that are not completely pure. Souls with unrepented mortal sin at death are not in a state of grace, thus purgatory is not an option.

So you really believe that Hitler and someone who isn't a perfect catholic are both eternally damned? How is that not condemning someone to hell? That is a pretty depressing God that is unmerciful. So, who is elgible for purgartory then? If the burden is that high, why doesn't the Pope ever say these things? Even Pope Bendict, who was about as conservative and tradional of a Pope we could ever have, never spoke in these terms? This not what catholicism is supposed to be about.

And I am not advocating water downed catholicism. Again, you can promote traditonal teachings - including Theology of the Body without the fire and brimstone.
Sep 14th 2013 new
(quote) Patrick-341178 said: So you really believe that Hitler and someone who isn't a perfect catholic are both eternally damned? How is that not condemning someone to hell? That is a pretty depressing God that is unmerciful. So, who is elgible for purgartory then? If the burden is that high, why doesn't the Pope ever say these things? Even Pope Bendict, who was about as conservative and tradional of a Pope we could ever have, never spoke in these terms? This not what catholicism is supposed to be about.

And I am not advocating water downed catholicism. Again, you can promote traditonal teachings - including Theology of the Body without the fire and brimstone.
Perhaps we need to start this discussion with you defining what you mean by the term "perfect Catholic"

Sep 14th 2013 new
We don't even know for sure Hitlers in Hell. I'm pretty sure the only person in hell formally defined by the Church fathers is Judas.

That being said, in one sense God doesn't decide who goes to hell, we do. If we commit grave sin, don't repent and continue on as it wasn't if we die we sent ourselves.

God set rules. ( He gets to do that). As long as we follow the rules and participate in life through charity well we are in good shape.

Without His grace we can't follow the rules. So we start there asking for grace!
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