(quote) Gerald-283546 said:
1. It was not a Sacrament but a renewal/reminder.
2. Baptism is a sacrament that can be administered by laity and even by Pagans, as has been the Catholic Tradition since Roman soldiers baptized saints before their martyrdom in the early years of the Church.
3. And, Methodists are part of the one, holy, catholic and apostolic church, as defined by Vatican II, although in imperfect communion due to some doctrinal and disciplinary disagreements. If you have ever had devout Methodist friends, you will know that their Faith is very, very similar to ours.
1. So what?
2. Baptism may only be administered by laity in specific circumstances, otherwise grave sin is committed in the act. (
Can. 861 1. The ordinary minister of baptism is a
bishop, a presbyter, or a deacon, without prejudice to the prescript of can. 530, n. 1.
2. When an ordinary minister is absent or impeded, a
catechist or another person designated for this function by the local ordinary,
or in a case of necessity any person with the right intention, confers baptism
licitly. Pastors of souls, especially the pastor of a parish, are to be
concerned that the Christian faithful are taught the correct way to baptize.)
3. As Lumen Gentium defines, Methodists are separated from the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church:
14. This Sacred Council wishes to turn its attention firstly to the Catholic
faithful. Basing itself upon Sacred Scripture and Tradition, it teaches that the
Church, now sojourning on earth as an exile, is necessary for salvation. Christ,
present to us in His Body, which is the Church, is the one Mediator and the
unique way of salvation. In explicit terms He Himself affirmed the necessity of
faith and baptism(124) and thereby affirmed also the necessity of the Church,
for through baptism as through a door men enter the Church. Whosoever,
therefore, knowing that the Catholic Church was made necessary by Christ, would
refuse to enter or to remain in it, could not be saved.
They are fully incorporated in the society of the Church who, possessing the
Spirit of Christ accept her entire system and all the means of salvation given
to her, and are united with her as part of her visible bodily structure and
through her with Christ, who rules her through the Supreme Pontiff and the
bishops. The bonds which bind men to the Church in a visible way are profession
of faith, the sacraments, and ecclesiastical government and communion. (Chelsea's comment: Methodists reject parts of the Church's system and some of the means of salvation given to her) He is not
saved, however, who, though part of the body of the Church, does not persevere
in charity. He remains indeed in the bosom of the Church, but, as it were, only
in a "bodily" manner and not "in his heart."(12*) All the
Church's children should remember that their exalted status is to be attributed
not to their own merits but to the special grace of Christ. If they fail
moreover to respond to that grace in thought, word and deed, not only shall they
not be saved but they will be the more severely judged.(13*)
Catechumens who, moved by the Holy Spirit, seek with explicit intention to
be incorporated into the Church are by that very intention joined with her. With
love and solicitude Mother Church already embraces them as her own.
15. The Church recognizes that in many ways she is linked with those who,
being baptized, are honored with the name of Christian, though they do not
profess the faith in its entirety or do not preserve unity of communion with the
successor of Peter. (14*) For there are many who honor Sacred Scripture, taking
it as a norm of belief and a pattern of life, and who show a sincere zeal. They
lovingly believe in God the Father Almighty and in Christ, the Son of God and
Saviour. (15*) They are consecrated by baptism, in which they are united with
Christ. They also recognize and accept other sacraments within their own
Churches or ecclesiastical communities. Many of them rejoice in the episcopate,
celebrate the Holy Eucharist and cultivate devotion toward the Virgin Mother of
God.(16*) They also share with us in prayer and other spiritual benefits.
Likewise we can say that in some real way they are joined with us in the Holy
Spirit, for to them too He gives His gifts and graces whereby He is operative
among them with His sanctifying power. Some indeed He has strengthened to the
extent of the shedding of their blood. In all of Christ's disciples the Spirit
arouses the desire to be peacefully united, in the manner determined by Christ,
as one flock under one shepherd, and He prompts them to pursue this end. (17*)
Mother Church never ceases to pray, hope and work that this may come about. (Chelsea's comment: This makes ABSOLUTELY NO sense if the Methodists, et al., are already united to Holy Mother Church) She
exhorts her children to purification and renewal so that the sign of Christ may
shine more brightly over the face of the earth.