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This room is for discussion related to learning about the faith (Catechetics), defense of the Faith (Apologetics), the Liturgy and canon law, motivated by a desire to grow closer to Christ or to bring someone else closer.

Saint Augustine of Hippo is considered on of the greatest Christian thinkers of all time and the Doctor of the Church.
Learn More: Saint Augustine

Jun 29th new
(quote) Jim-875732 said: Well, I said it about men and cleavage: Eyes up, guys. Same to you ladies. Eyes up.
I don't think the women necessarily struggle not to look down or with lustful thoughts in the presence of speedos (at least, I don't). But I do think they reveal too much information about the guy wearing one. They certainly aren't dignified and they don't hide enough of what should be covered for male modesty. (Seems to me that bikinis are more or less the female equivalent of speedos, though some are way more provocative than others, whereas speedos all seem about the same in my limited experience with them.)

I really do think that modesty is important because it is a way of treating yourself with respect, which hopefully influences you to treat others with respect no matter how they are dressed.

However, if a person is dressed in such a way that their fellow human beings have a difficult time gaining or regaining custody of their eyes, the outfit itself is probably too much. I think we should all dress in a way that shows self respect, and doing so would automatically keep things relatively modesty, I think.
Jun 29th new
(quote) Devan-877827 said:

Your distinction is between modesty and chauvinism, which modesty is not. Modesty is good, through and through, and is a part of the virtue of temperance, which is a cardinal virtue. This isn't my teaching, this is the Catholic Church speaking.

2521 Purity requires modesty, an integral part of temperance. Modesty protects the intimate center of the person. It means refusing to unveil what should remain hidden. It is ordered to chastity to whose sensitivity it bears witness. It guides how one looks at others and behaves toward them in conformity with the dignity of persons and their solidarity.

2522 Modesty protects the mystery of persons and their love. It encourages patience and moderation in loving relationships; it requires that the conditions for the definitive giving and commitment of man and woman to one another be fulfilled. Modesty is decency. It inspires one's choice of clothing. It keeps silence or reserve where there is evident risk of unhealthy curiosity. It is discreet.

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s2c2a9.htm

My point, plain is simple is this: people can harbor different reasons for being modest. Some reasons stem from virtue while some reasons stem from a disordered philosophy. (I am not pointing a finger at anyone here, at all. Merely making a point.) An obvious example may (key word: may) be the dictate in the Muslim community for women to cover themselves head to toe. But then again, I do not know their full intentions.

I do not believe anyone here disputes the value or beauty of modesty. Well, so far...It is indeed integral to a life of holiness.
Jun 29th new
(quote) Jean-504066 said: I don't think the women necessarily struggle not to look down or with lustful thoughts in the presence of speedos (at least, I don't). But I do think they reveal too much information about the guy wearing one. They certainly aren't dignified and they don't hide enough of what should be covered for male modesty. (Seems to me that bikinis are more or less the female equivalent of speedos, though some are way more provocative than others, whereas speedos all seem about the same in my limited experience with them.)

I really do think that modesty is important because it is a way of treating yourself with respect, which hopefully influences you to treat others with respect no matter how they are dressed.

However, if a person is dressed in such a way that their fellow human beings have a difficult time gaining or regaining custody of their eyes, the outfit itself is probably too much. I think we should all dress in a way that shows self respect, and doing so would automatically keep things relatively modesty, I think.
To a certain extent, men who wear tight muscle-defining shirts and tight pants...are doing so to impress other men.

When I see a man dressed a certain way my first thought might be, the body is a work of art. My second thought will be, he's probably gay.
Jun 29th new
(quote) Susan-1048377 said: When I see a man dressed a certain way my first thought might be, the body is a work of art. My second thought will be, he's probably gay.
If he's wearing tight clothes to impress other guys, you might assume he's gay; but actually, the chances of him being gay are only about 98%.
Jun 29th new
@Tony, I feel obliged to respond as an African woman. I wonder which part of Africa you referred to. I would be curious to know, because where I come from, modesty is key to women. There are still women who still go with fashion but I still believe African women dress modestly at least for church.
I would love to hear your views on people wearing shorts, leggings, etc. for mass. Personally I don't feel comfortable as a woman, and as a catholic. I always consider church as a wedding place where I am the bride going to meet my groom, one has to be well dressed( my outfit for church is what I would wear for a job interview). If I would want to impress the jury, why not impress my God out of respect at least.... Your thoughts... I may be wrong being new in this country, but today I saw someone going to present offertory to the pastor in a small/short, and I wondered what the pastor thought by looking at that outfit. Its sad.

Take time to listen to this homily around immodesty. God bless you all!

www.youtube.com


Jun 29th new
(quote) Aline-1103561 said: @Tony, I feel obliged to respond as an African woman. I wonder which part of Africa you referred to. I would be curious to know, because where I come from, modesty is key to women. There are still women who still go with fashion but I still believe African women dress modestly at least for church.


The San people came up in another discussion on modesty recently, so I think they are the people he was referring to.
Jun 29th new
(quote) Lauren-927923 said: HI Charles, wasn't this Audrey Hepburn?? I love this quote whichever Hepburn said it :-)
OOPS, Sorry about that.You are correct.It was Audrey Hepburn.That is what happens when one posts while half awake.
Jun 29th new
I think is because some people do not even care nor respect God 's word, and they do what they wishes. They called personal choices. And obviously their spiritually is death .
Jun 29th new
(quote) Paul-1049651 said: If he's wearing tight clothes to impress other guys, you might assume he's gay; but actually, the chances of him being gay are only about 98%.
And 2% chance he's a vain heterosexual. laughing laughing laughing
Jun 29th new
(quote) Susan-1048377 said: And 2% chance he's a vain heterosexual.
Many men and women work hard to get great bodies and like to show them off. I think it has to do more with vanity than sexuality.
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